Future Events The Great Debate - Will Zoro kill Kaido this arc?
This is how I picture it:
Before the final fight between Kaido and Luffy, Luffy will inflict a deep wound to Kaido, most likely open the old scar. Ultimately, Luffy will beat Kaido and knock him out. However once Kaido came back to his senses, he will turn into a Dragon again and try to do as much collateral damage as possible. This is when Zoro will jump into the skies and behead Kaido. Becoming the new sword god of Wano.
Before the final fight between Kaido and Luffy, Luffy will inflict a deep wound to Kaido, most likely open the old scar. Ultimately, Luffy will beat Kaido and knock him out. However once Kaido came back to his senses, he will turn into a Dragon again and try to do as much collateral damage as possible. This is when Zoro will jump into the skies and behead Kaido. Becoming the new sword god of Wano.
Eh...The problem with the whole set-up is that it wasn't just telegraphed, Oda and his team shouted it from the rooftops. Even the One Piece Magazine hinted that Ryuma's legend will potentially be recreated. I mean, sure if that's what Oda intends. But making allusions every other chapter? Feels like too much to me.
We all saw what happened with the Vivre Card plotline. A decade's worth of theories almost all eventually agreeing that this will be key to Big Mom and Luffy becoming allies or even friends. It was just that obvious. Come to WCI and Oda goes "LOL NOPE". It barely enabled them to escape, and that's it. And the Tamatebako, did the same thing.
( if Luffy and BM do become allies or declare a truce, it wont be because of the Vivre Card will it? That ship has gone and sailed)
Oda isn't even being subtle. The whole Zoro potentially being from Wano hints. Then just being handed the very sword that Oden used. It's so blatant. Now it's getting hammered over and over again. I dunno. I'm really suspicious of this whole thing panning out the way many think it will.
Not to mention that the scenarios where Zoro kills Kaidou either involve him doing so in concert with others. So not a proper one-vs-one as did happen with Ryuma and arguably, Oden. Or, in situations where Zoro straights up murders a weakened, defeated Kaidou ( which begs the question - if that's his intent, how the hells would Oda have Yamato join the people who murdered her father. Oda just won't do it for the optics). In WCI yes the SH's agreed to assassinate BM, but the actual attempt was done by Capone and it failed. Oda may give the SH's the intention or motivation, but as he writes the damn story he will make damn sure not to write them as anything other than heroes ( spare the whole Luffy isn't a hero thing. He is - because Oda writes the plot that makes him so by feats and circumstances. Oda's writing isn't complex. Also a major point, Zoro is also a hero. He's the classical Ronin type).
The other thing that makes me suspect 'Zoro killing Kaidou' may not be as certain is the inspiration behind Kaidou himself. Based on Shuten Douji the greatest Oni of Japan. Long story short, if anyone had bothered to read up on it, they'd find that Shuten Douji was killed (there are versions where he was merely beheaded, but the head was still alive) by a group of four Samurai heroes who disguised themselves as courtesans or entertainers, slipped in while Shuten Douji and his gang were partying and even fed him drugged magic wine so he'd be thoroughly intoxicated. As he laid drunk, the four noble Samurai tied his limbs to the four corners of his bed and the main Samurai chopped his head off. Shuten Douji actually makes a cutting remark that 'Oni don't lie' - referrring to the Samurai's trickery. There's your noble Samurai sprit LMAO.
Even Oden was leading his Scabbards to originally assassinate, not have to fight Kaidou. Point being, the 'Zoro kills Kaidou' angle fits more as the culmination of the original plan to assassinate Kaidou and take his head. So this either has to happen fairly early on, or has to happen at the end where a defeated Kaidou gets murdered by Zoro.
One point that is sorta neglected is that Wano up to now is structured as a Wano-centric arc (huh??). By which I mean the action and immediate impact are all contained in Wano. The plot follows all sorts of legends and historical allusions and inspirations that Oda has been cooking up for 20 over years based on Japan. Yes Big Mom is there but even she now looks like a Wano courtesan, it's still all about the Wano-esque protion of the arc. Not quite the rest of the story.
This is Oda's homage to pre-modern, Old Japan of yore. Kaidou is basically an Oni the generic monster villain. The great Samurai or Hero kills the Oni. Classic Japanese legend. But that isn't the whole story. Kaidou is more than just a stand-in for Shuten Douji or whichever generic Oni of legend. He's also a pirate, an Emperor whose territory and influence spans across the NW. He and his crew have connections outside Wano.
And Oda already hinted with the mention of Vegapunk, the presence of CP0 at the onset, the possibility of the Marines coming in. These are no longer Wano-esque elements, but speak to the wider world and the larger plot. Even a senior editor noted that the ending of Wano will be a 'surprise' (guess Zoro killing Kaidou isn't one then. how can it be if they've been massively hinting it).
If we think Dressrosa was massive and messy, note how many factions were involved there. You had Yonkous, Marines, Revs, - the major players. But Doflamingo wasn't even a Yonkou, but an allied subordinate of one. The one whose defeat has been the goal all throughout the NW saga. You can bet that we will be seeing the Marines incoming and not just to mop up the fallen villains, maybe even the Revs along with other factions. In other words, once the Wano portion is somewhat concluded, the second half of the Wano arc will open up to become a world-changing one.
If the argument is Zoro cuts Kaidou, yeah that's happening. But the more Oda lays it on that 'Zoro will kill Kaidou', the less I believe it.
Not to say it will not happen of course. No skin off my back. But then I'd be wondering how Luffy will top that.[/QUOTE]
We all saw what happened with the Vivre Card plotline. A decade's worth of theories almost all eventually agreeing that this will be key to Big Mom and Luffy becoming allies or even friends. It was just that obvious. Come to WCI and Oda goes "LOL NOPE". It barely enabled them to escape, and that's it. And the Tamatebako, did the same thing.
( if Luffy and BM do become allies or declare a truce, it wont be because of the Vivre Card will it? That ship has gone and sailed)
Oda isn't even being subtle. The whole Zoro potentially being from Wano hints. Then just being handed the very sword that Oden used. It's so blatant. Now it's getting hammered over and over again. I dunno. I'm really suspicious of this whole thing panning out the way many think it will.
Not to mention that the scenarios where Zoro kills Kaidou either involve him doing so in concert with others. So not a proper one-vs-one as did happen with Ryuma and arguably, Oden. Or, in situations where Zoro straights up murders a weakened, defeated Kaidou ( which begs the question - if that's his intent, how the hells would Oda have Yamato join the people who murdered her father. Oda just won't do it for the optics). In WCI yes the SH's agreed to assassinate BM, but the actual attempt was done by Capone and it failed. Oda may give the SH's the intention or motivation, but as he writes the damn story he will make damn sure not to write them as anything other than heroes ( spare the whole Luffy isn't a hero thing. He is - because Oda writes the plot that makes him so by feats and circumstances. Oda's writing isn't complex. Also a major point, Zoro is also a hero. He's the classical Ronin type).
The other thing that makes me suspect 'Zoro killing Kaidou' may not be as certain is the inspiration behind Kaidou himself. Based on Shuten Douji the greatest Oni of Japan. Long story short, if anyone had bothered to read up on it, they'd find that Shuten Douji was killed (there are versions where he was merely beheaded, but the head was still alive) by a group of four Samurai heroes who disguised themselves as courtesans or entertainers, slipped in while Shuten Douji and his gang were partying and even fed him drugged magic wine so he'd be thoroughly intoxicated. As he laid drunk, the four noble Samurai tied his limbs to the four corners of his bed and the main Samurai chopped his head off. Shuten Douji actually makes a cutting remark that 'Oni don't lie' - referrring to the Samurai's trickery. There's your noble Samurai sprit LMAO.
Even Oden was leading his Scabbards to originally assassinate, not have to fight Kaidou. Point being, the 'Zoro kills Kaidou' angle fits more as the culmination of the original plan to assassinate Kaidou and take his head. So this either has to happen fairly early on, or has to happen at the end where a defeated Kaidou gets murdered by Zoro.
One point that is sorta neglected is that Wano up to now is structured as a Wano-centric arc (huh??). By which I mean the action and immediate impact are all contained in Wano. The plot follows all sorts of legends and historical allusions and inspirations that Oda has been cooking up for 20 over years based on Japan. Yes Big Mom is there but even she now looks like a Wano courtesan, it's still all about the Wano-esque protion of the arc. Not quite the rest of the story.
This is Oda's homage to pre-modern, Old Japan of yore. Kaidou is basically an Oni the generic monster villain. The great Samurai or Hero kills the Oni. Classic Japanese legend. But that isn't the whole story. Kaidou is more than just a stand-in for Shuten Douji or whichever generic Oni of legend. He's also a pirate, an Emperor whose territory and influence spans across the NW. He and his crew have connections outside Wano.
And Oda already hinted with the mention of Vegapunk, the presence of CP0 at the onset, the possibility of the Marines coming in. These are no longer Wano-esque elements, but speak to the wider world and the larger plot. Even a senior editor noted that the ending of Wano will be a 'surprise' (guess Zoro killing Kaidou isn't one then. how can it be if they've been massively hinting it).
If we think Dressrosa was massive and messy, note how many factions were involved there. You had Yonkous, Marines, Revs, - the major players. But Doflamingo wasn't even a Yonkou, but an allied subordinate of one. The one whose defeat has been the goal all throughout the NW saga. You can bet that we will be seeing the Marines incoming and not just to mop up the fallen villains, maybe even the Revs along with other factions. In other words, once the Wano portion is somewhat concluded, the second half of the Wano arc will open up to become a world-changing one.
If the argument is Zoro cuts Kaidou, yeah that's happening. But the more Oda lays it on that 'Zoro will kill Kaidou', the less I believe it.
Not to say it will not happen of course. No skin off my back. But then I'd be wondering how Luffy will top that.[/QUOTE]
All of them are sideplots though, the goal of the the strawhats in wci was to firstly get sanji back and secondly steal a road ponyglpyh rubbing both of which they accomplished. The rest of what you wrote, Memes vc, the tamatebako box, the assassination attempt were all side plots that oda could do whatever he wanted with to make the shs achieve both their objectives.
Here the main objective is the raid to kill orochi and kaido, this isnt a side plot its the whole reason they are there.
I fail to see how if indeed zoro does kill kaido above the flower capital like ryuma and end his 20 plus year stranglehold on wano that he will be seen as anything other than a hero.
Yamato is a non issue here, she already cast him aside and pledged herself for the kozuki
Which is the same plan they have now, which also broke into a war.
With this arc being japan as you say not to mention kaido the dragon representing china doesnt it make sense the sh who oda said would be Japanese could fulfill such a role.
His 2 biggest connections doflamingo and big mom have been dealt with by the story though, big mom is here with him and doffy has lost and is in impel down, with law and the shs destroying the other factories.
Orochi wanted vegapunk and was the reason for cp0s presence in the arc, he is dead.
With kaido taking onigashima to the flower capital the stakes and the path to the end of the arc has been accelerated, i doubt we will see any major players at this stage.
If the marines werent busy enough with the warlords its very likely they are going to have a run in with teach based on his own words
With sakazuki saying they dont have the resources to send to wano theres good reason for that.
Thats probably the biggest reason why meme is here.
Here the main objective is the raid to kill orochi and kaido, this isnt a side plot its the whole reason they are there.
I fail to see how if indeed zoro does kill kaido above the flower capital like ryuma and end his 20 plus year stranglehold on wano that he will be seen as anything other than a hero.
Yamato is a non issue here, she already cast him aside and pledged herself for the kozuki
Which is the same plan they have now, which also broke into a war.
With this arc being japan as you say not to mention kaido the dragon representing china doesnt it make sense the sh who oda said would be Japanese could fulfill such a role.
His 2 biggest connections doflamingo and big mom have been dealt with by the story though, big mom is here with him and doffy has lost and is in impel down, with law and the shs destroying the other factories.
Orochi wanted vegapunk and was the reason for cp0s presence in the arc, he is dead.
With kaido taking onigashima to the flower capital the stakes and the path to the end of the arc has been accelerated, i doubt we will see any major players at this stage.
If the marines werent busy enough with the warlords its very likely they are going to have a run in with teach based on his own words
With sakazuki saying they dont have the resources to send to wano theres good reason for that.
Thats probably the biggest reason why meme is here.
All of them are sideplots though, the goal of the the strawhats in wci was to firstly get sanji back and secondly steal a road ponyglpyh rubbing both of which they accomplished. The rest of what you wrote, Memes vc, the tamatebako box, the assassination attempt were all side plots that oda could do whatever he wanted with to make the shs achieve both their objectives.
Here the main objective is the raid to kill orochi and kaido, this isnt a side plot its the whole reason they are there.
I fail to see how if indeed zoro does kill kaido above the flower capital like ryuma and end his 20 plus year stranglehold on wano that he will be seen as anything other than a hero.
Yamato is a non issue here, she already cast him aside and pledged herself for the kozuki
Which is the same plan they have now, which also broke into a war.
With this arc being japan as you say not to mention kaido the dragon representing china doesnt it make sense the sh who oda said would be Japanese could fulfill such a role.
His 2 biggest connections doflamingo and big mom have been dealt with by the story though, big mom is here with him and doffy has lost and is in impel down, with law and the shs destroying the other factories.
Orochi wanted vegapunk and was the reason for cp0s presence in the arc, he is dead.
With kaido taking onigashima to the flower capital the stakes and the path to the end of the arc has been accelerated, i doubt we will see any major players at this stage.
If the marines werent busy enough with the warlords its very likely they are going to have a run in with teach based on his own words
With sakazuki saying they dont have the resources to send to wano theres good reason for that.
Thats probably the biggest reason why meme is here.
Here the main objective is the raid to kill orochi and kaido, this isnt a side plot its the whole reason they are there.
I fail to see how if indeed zoro does kill kaido above the flower capital like ryuma and end his 20 plus year stranglehold on wano that he will be seen as anything other than a hero.
Yamato is a non issue here, she already cast him aside and pledged herself for the kozuki
Which is the same plan they have now, which also broke into a war.
With this arc being japan as you say not to mention kaido the dragon representing china doesnt it make sense the sh who oda said would be Japanese could fulfill such a role.
His 2 biggest connections doflamingo and big mom have been dealt with by the story though, big mom is here with him and doffy has lost and is in impel down, with law and the shs destroying the other factories.
Orochi wanted vegapunk and was the reason for cp0s presence in the arc, he is dead.
With kaido taking onigashima to the flower capital the stakes and the path to the end of the arc has been accelerated, i doubt we will see any major players at this stage.
If the marines werent busy enough with the warlords its very likely they are going to have a run in with teach based on his own words
With sakazuki saying they dont have the resources to send to wano theres good reason for that.
Thats probably the biggest reason why meme is here.
You're trying to argue based on how the arc appears to be unfolding. I'm not. I'm not even denying the whole 'Zoro Kill Kaidou' angle is prevalent and being emphasized over and over again. My point is, Oda has and can swerve the story. That things are not set in stone and looking at how he writes in the past and his potential inspiration I am not too sure if he has something bigger in mind. But go ahead and argue and believe that yes,' Zoro kills Kaidou' because the panels are there. It's just too blatant that I feel Oda could pull the wool from under our collective feet. If he follows through then that's fine. The story moves on to the next chapter.
Looking back at past fights we have had Krieg finally being knocked out by Gin, while Luffy was unconscious. It was still clear that Luffy was the one to beat Krieg though. If ZKK happens it would have to be like that, just far more dramatic and with Zoro also having big moments leading up to the final hit.
