What kind of twitter/reddit warrior shit is this? Had an account for less than 12 hours and already claim people are afraid of you? You're just repeating the same arguments I addressed multiple times when the thread was made in 2020. You literally bring nothing new.
I saw a dumb post on a website unknown to me, made an account and debunked it. You haven't addressed anything I said. You want me to quote you?
99% of the things you post were dumb stuff that said "Well, three means three so there must be three great powers, there is no context, there is no discussion. So Shichibukai+Marines>Yonko." And I asked you for a SINGLE point, and you did not give me any and just spouted the number 3. New things don't need to be added because they already debunk you.
Why am I even bothering with you? You only read the points of people you agree with. And you're afraid to lose. Prove me right.
This entire thread is not a "debunk" that Marines+Shichibukai=1 Yonko. In fact, all your points are much more easily and more coherently explained by simply saying that Marines+Shichibukai=>1 Yonko.
For example, your Influence part is just saying that the Marines are afraid of the influence of Yonkos, and you attempt to use this logic to somehow debunk that Yonkos are stronger than Admirals. But you do realize that this would still make sense if the Yonkos are just straight up stronger than the Marines, right? In fact, it makes even more sense that way. It makes little to no sense if 1 Yonko is just a tiny piece of power that they can easily get rid of, but just don't for plot convenience reasons that you've been advocating for.
The Resources part is also more easily explained by 1 Yonko=<Marines+Shichibukai. Obviously, resources play a big role. However, the Marines' fears are more easily explained by the idea that they cannot handle more than 1 Yonko. Obviously, they do not want to lose resources, but it makes more sense if the amount of resources they would lose is so much that they would rather not fight any of the Yonko IF Yonkos are around as strong as they are individually.
The Timing stuff you mentioned is the most irrelevant BS I have ever seen. Neither Big Mom nor Kaido acknowledge the Marines as threats. Yet you take statements from Marines themselves saying that two Yonkos combining just happened at the worst possible time and somehow took that to mean that Kaido and Big Mom are afraid of the Marines. It's one thing if they said something like "Thankfully, the Marines are occupied." but they never even imply that. They didn't even read the newspapers that said they abolished the Shichibukai until AFTER Big Mom started going to Wano. So that Timing point is complete and utter BS. What the Marines are saying is that two Yonkos combining is a hard thing to deal with if they can deal with it at all, and on top of that, the Marines have another nuisance in their hands, to take out the Shichibukai, which made the already annoying problem of the Yonkos combining even more annoying.
Your stuff about Kaido somehow saying Yonko=Shichibukai+Marines is just complete nonsense. It's just him saying "The Marines are no longer the strongest individual force of the seas, so each Yonko can take over the WG" or something of the sort.
The part where you state that Yonkos not being together is irrelevant is irrelevant. The fact that they're not united means they're superpowers each on their own. Garp's statement is simply saying the WG is the most powerful of the superpowers, and they established the Shichibukai AND Marines so that it stays as the most powerful superpower. It is saying that the WG is stronger than ANY individual superpower, meaning it is stronger than EACH of the Yonko, not all of them combined. In fact, the fact that they're not together means that no single Yonko wants to fight any other or weaken their forces because it directly leaves them vulnerable to the other two, to the point that they could be wiped out. It's not the WG itself holding balance against all 4 Yonko by itself, it is each Yonko stalemating the others, and the WG being the 5th party in that stalemate. If what you're saying is true and Marines are stronger than all of them combined, the fear of loss of resources from dealing with 1 or 2 Yonko is nowhere near enough fear the WG gives them. We've already seen that Kaido, Big Mom, Whitebeard, and even Shanks are willing to use resources for a good enough cause, or even no good cause at all. Kaido and Big Mom would rather not fight, but they will if they piss each other off. Shanks was willing to fight the Marines if they didn't end the war. Whitebeard literally sacrificed his entire crew for Ace. They don't care about resources as much as you are saying. Even the Marines themselves send forces to take down Shichibukai, and if them never wanting to lose resources was true, they would have just let the Shichibukai, who have helped them for years, just roam around without actually engaging them, especially Mihawk, who is the reason Shanks is a Yonko.
tl:dr your post and points are much more easily explained by saying 1 Yonko is almost equal to, but slightly weaker than Shichibukai+Marines.
Yeah, I think Marineford sort of demonstrates that the marines and the warlords have greater power than any singular emperor, but the fact that the marines and the warlords had to band together to deal with a single emperor highlights how the individual emperors are massive threats, much less 2 or all of them together.
As you said, the emperors aren't a unified body fighting for the same cause unlike something like even the warlords, which could be compelled to fight under a single banner if the world government demanded it. The marines and the warlords existed to allow the marines to keep on top of any individual emperor that decided to do their own thing. Its also worth noting that strategic advantage would also play a part in those sorts of confrontations. Kaido has 20,000 troops(30,000 if you count Orochi's forces), while a significant number of navy forces would count over 100,000(which was the number at marineford, and was made out to be a significant number of troops for the navy to deploy).
In terms of numbers, the navy is significantly larger, but its also worth considering locational advantage. Each of the emperors control their own territory, and as such, it would never be easy for the navy to invade any single emperors territory without potentially getting ambushed and wiped out.
Big Mum has a spy system of snails that would inform her of any attempt of the navy to enter her territory. Kaido lives in Wano, which is notoriously hard to enter under ones own power, and leaves them open to ambushes like the big mum pirates were, and you had Whitebeard, who wiped out 37 marine ships that were supposed to be containing him in his territory with ease apparently.
So yeah, even though each emperor collectively posseses less military might than the navy in terms of raw numbers, they each have other advantages, and have enough power to where it would not be guarenteed that the navy would easily be able to take on an emperor by themselves. In that sense, the warlords are sort of "insurance" to give the navy an extra edge over the emperors.
Yeah, I think Marineford sort of demonstrates that the marines and the warlords have greater power than any singular emperor, but the fact that the marines and the warlords had to band together to deal with a single emperor highlights how the individual emperors are massive threats, much less 2 or all of them together.
As you said, the emperors aren't a unified body fighting for the same cause unlike something like even the warlords, which could be compelled to fight under a single banner if the world government demanded it. The marines and the warlords existed to allow the marines to keep on top of any individual emperor that decided to do their own thing. Its also worth noting that strategic advantage would also play a part in those sorts of confrontations. Kaido has 20,000 troops(30,000 if you count Orochi's forces), while a significant number of navy forces would count over 100,000(which was the number at marineford, and was made out to be a significant number of troops for the navy to deploy).
In terms of numbers, the navy is significantly larger, but its also worth considering locational advantage. Each of the emperors control their own territory, and as such, it would never be easy for the navy to invade any single emperors territory without potentially getting ambushed and wiped out.
Big Mum has a spy system of snails that would inform her of any attempt of the navy to enter her territory. Kaido lives in Wano, which is notoriously hard to enter under ones own power, and leaves them open to ambushes like the big mum pirates were, and you had Whitebeard, who wiped out 37 marine ships that were supposed to be containing him in his territory with ease apparently.
So yeah, even though each emperor collectively posseses less military might than the navy in terms of raw numbers, they each have other advantages, and have enough power to where it would not be guarenteed that the navy would easily be able to take on an emperor by themselves. In that sense, the warlords are sort of "insurance" to give the navy an extra edge over the emperors.
I saw a dumb post on a website unknown to me, made an account and debunked it. You haven't addressed anything I said. You want me to quote you?
99% of the things you post were dumb stuff that said "Well, three means three so there must be three great powers, there is no context, there is no discussion. So Shichibukai+Marines>Yonko." And I asked you for a SINGLE point, and you did not give me any and just spouted the number 3. New things don't need to be added because they already debunk you.
Why am I even bothering with you? You only read the points of people you agree with. And you're afraid to lose. Prove me right.
So you created an account to revive an old thread, repeat what others said, and claim people are afraid of you like some online warrior?
My opening post addresses everything you mentioned and compiles all my points, and I've already given counter arguments to everything you mentioned since you're repeating old arguments.
And nice strawman. Never said Marines+Shichibukai>Yonko. First you claim direct statements are BS and now you put words in my mouth.
Yeah, I think Marineford sort of demonstrates that the marines and the warlords have greater power than any singular emperor, but the fact that the marines and the warlords had to band together to deal with a single emperor highlights how the individual emperors are massive threats, much less 2 or all of them together.
As you said, the emperors aren't a unified body fighting for the same cause unlike something like even the warlords, which could be compelled to fight under a single banner if the world government demanded it. The marines and the warlords existed to allow the marines to keep on top of any individual emperor that decided to do their own thing. Its also worth noting that strategic advantage would also play a part in those sorts of confrontations. Kaido has 20,000 troops(30,000 if you count Orochi's forces), while a significant number of navy forces would count over 100,000(which was the number at marineford, and was made out to be a significant number of troops for the navy to deploy).
In terms of numbers, the navy is significantly larger, but its also worth considering locational advantage. Each of the emperors control their own territory, and as such, it would never be easy for the navy to invade any single emperors territory without potentially getting ambushed and wiped out.
Big Mum has a spy system of snails that would inform her of any attempt of the navy to enter her territory. Kaido lives in Wano, which is notoriously hard to enter under ones own power, and leaves them open to ambushes like the big mum pirates were, and you had Whitebeard, who wiped out 37 marine ships that were supposed to be containing him in his territory with ease apparently.
So yeah, even though each emperor collectively posseses less military might than the navy in terms of raw numbers, they each have other advantages, and have enough power to where it would not be guarenteed that the navy would easily be able to take on an emperor by themselves. In that sense, the warlords are sort of "insurance" to give the navy an extra edge over the emperors.
They all banded together for the best possible outcome. When Kaido and BM joined hands, Akainu never said they couldn't handle it. He directly said that they were already busy and spread thin dealing with other incidents.
Kaido freaked out about going to war with BM and King almost got BM killed despite her crew being there, which shows that simple power levels don't work. Each Emperor requires prep time and planning and we saw in Marineford how many outside sources got involved helping the WBP.
Do people still believe this ?
Current strawhats and co are already beating 1 Yonko + crew +1 another Yonko while Marines will be taken down later with stronger strawhats and even more allies
If Marine+Warlords~1 Yonko then 2 Yonko wouldn't need ancient weapons
People always bring up their MF power levels to counter but never mention any of the advantages the WBP had.
1. The ID team showed up and were key players
2. Luffy had the usual MC plot armor
3. Whitebeard, Marco and Luffy would have easily been killed but the admirals walked away for no reason(it's no different to Kaido not killing the Scabbards and throwing Luffy in the ocean instead of killing him. Also like King not killing Marco and just leaving for no reason).
4. Warlords helped the WBP
5. Marines had the WBP beaten thanks to Siege Walls(turf advantage) but a combination of Luffy, Jinbe and Iva(and Kizaru not killing Oars for no reason) to create a big enough distraction.
Despite all that, the Marines still got a one sided victory with only 2 Vice Admirals beaten. It's always "WB was severely nerfed" and nothing else.
People always bring up their MF power levels to counter but never mention any of the advantages the WBP had.
1. The ID team showed up and were key players
2. Luffy had the usual MC plot armor
3. Whitebeard, Marco and Luffy would have easily been killed but the admirals walked away for no reason(it's no different to Kaido not killing the Scabbards and throwing Luffy in the ocean instead of killing him. Also like King not killing Marco and just leaving for no reason).
4. Warlords helped the WBP
5. Marines had the WBP beaten thanks to Siege Walls(turf advantage) but a combination of Luffy, Jinbe and Iva(and Kizaru not killing Oars for no reason) to create a big enough distraction.
Despite all that, the Marines still got a one sided victory with only 2 Vice Admirals beaten. It's always "WB was severely nerfed" and nothing else.
The warlords present on the Marines side (Mihawk, Doflamingo, Kuma, Hancock) were all fucking around and not fighting seriously. At the end of the war, Borsalino was completely fresh, Kuzan had a bruised lip and Sakazuki was moderately injured. Add the context that the Admirals were nerfed by fighting at Marine HQ (thereby not using what Akainu and Aokiji used to turn Punk Hazard into a complete wasteland - most probably DF awakenings) and that's almost a one-sided beatdown considering the losses on the side of the WBP.
Do people still believe this ?
Current strawhats and co are already beating 1 Yonko + crew +1 another Yonko while Marines will be taken down later with stronger strawhats and even more allies
If Marine+Warlords~1 Yonko then 2 Yonko wouldn't need ancient weapons
They're not "beating" the Yonko and their crew. As the CP0 have said in one of the latest chapters, they heard that King got defeated by Zoro, yet they also say that him getting defeated is completely meaningless as long as the Yonkos themselves are alive.
The Strawhats are nowhere near enough to beat them. And even if they do, the Marines getting taken down by the current Strawhats isn't contradicting anything. Later on, the someone like Imu or Blackbeard could become the actual threat the Strawhats have to face, not the Marines. There are infinite possibilities. The Marines don't have to be that much stronger than the Yonkos.
2 Yonko needing Ancient Weapons is not disproving anything. Not only do they need to take down the WG, they also need to fight the other Emperors, who could also be making their own alliance.
So you created an account to revive an old thread, repeat what others said, and claim people are afraid of you like some online warrior?
My opening post addresses everything you mentioned and compiles all my points, and I've already given counter arguments to everything you mentioned since you're repeating old arguments.
And nice strawman. Never said Marines+Shichibukai>Yonko. First you claim direct statements are BS and now you put words in my mouth.
They all banded together for the best possible outcome. When Kaido and BM joined hands, Akainu never said they couldn't handle it. He directly said that they were already busy and spread thin dealing with other incidents.
Kaido freaked out about going to war with BM and King almost got BM killed despite her crew being there, which shows that simple power levels don't work. Each Emperor requires prep time and planning and we saw in Marineford how many outside sources got involved helping the WBP.
I would rather have wrong people know that they're wrong. Your "hero" if you will.
Your opening post addresses none of my stuff. NONE. In fact, my comment is a RESPONSE to your BS. It is clear that you have not read anything because
A) You claim that I repeated points when I didn't
B) You claim you responded to me when you didn't
C) You're continuing to run away from me while claiming things that didn't happen.
And there is no strawman, you're just being proven wrong. You said that Marines+Shichibukai COULD take out the Yonko, and you even state "Never did the Marines say that they couldn't take down the Emperors"
Akainu never stating they couldn't handle it is not proof of anything. That's just his pride. Just like Big Mom and Kaido's pride about the Marines being weak or whatever. They're all BS and not true. Them dealing with other incidents just made the already hard situation even harder.
Kaido never freaked out, you're making shit up.
See? I already addressed most of these and debunked them, yet you keep mentioning them. None of my arguments were EVER addressed. I'll ask you to give me a SINGLE argument of mine that you've addressed. JUST ONE. How tf are you a moderator?
Let me state this for the millionth time. All your "points" are much more easily explained by a 5 way stalemate. You have to delve into headcanon and mental gymnastics to interpret it in a way that is Marines+Shichibukai=>Yonko or some shit like this.
This entire thread is not a "debunk" that Marines+Shichibukai=1 Yonko. In fact, all your points are much more easily and more coherently explained by simply saying that Marines+Shichibukai=>1 Yonko.
For example, your Influence part is just saying that the Marines are afraid of the influence of Yonkos, and you attempt to use this logic to somehow debunk that Yonkos are stronger than Admirals. But you do realize that this would still make sense if the Yonkos are just straight up stronger than the Marines, right? In fact, it makes even more sense that way. It makes little to no sense if 1 Yonko is just a tiny piece of power that they can easily get rid of, but just don't for plot convenience reasons that you've been advocating for.
The Resources part is also more easily explained by 1 Yonko=<Marines+Shichibukai. Obviously, resources play a big role. However, the Marines' fears are more easily explained by the idea that they cannot handle more than 1 Yonko. Obviously, they do not want to lose resources, but it makes more sense if the amount of resources they would lose is so much that they would rather not fight any of the Yonko IF Yonkos are around as strong as they are individually.
The Timing stuff you mentioned is the most irrelevant BS I have ever seen. Neither Big Mom nor Kaido acknowledge the Marines as threats. Yet you take statements from Marines themselves saying that two Yonkos combining just happened at the worst possible time and somehow took that to mean that Kaido and Big Mom are afraid of the Marines. It's one thing if they said something like "Thankfully, the Marines are occupied." but they never even imply that. They didn't even read the newspapers that said they abolished the Shichibukai until AFTER Big Mom started going to Wano. So that Timing point is complete and utter BS. What the Marines are saying is that two Yonkos combining is a hard thing to deal with if they can deal with it at all, and on top of that, the Marines have another nuisance in their hands, to take out the Shichibukai, which made the already annoying problem of the Yonkos combining even more annoying.
Your stuff about Kaido somehow saying Yonko=Shichibukai+Marines is just complete nonsense. It's just him saying "The Marines are no longer the strongest individual force of the seas, so each Yonko can take over the WG" or something of the sort.
The part where you state that Yonkos not being together is irrelevant is irrelevant. The fact that they're not united means they're superpowers each on their own. Garp's statement is simply saying the WG is the most powerful of the superpowers, and they established the Shichibukai AND Marines so that it stays as the most powerful superpower. It is saying that the WG is stronger than ANY individual superpower, meaning it is stronger than EACH of the Yonko, not all of them combined. In fact, the fact that they're not together means that no single Yonko wants to fight any other or weaken their forces because it directly leaves them vulnerable to the other two, to the point that they could be wiped out. It's not the WG itself holding balance against all 4 Yonko by itself, it is each Yonko stalemating the others, and the WG being the 5th party in that stalemate. If what you're saying is true and Marines are stronger than all of them combined, the fear of loss of resources from dealing with 1 or 2 Yonko is nowhere near enough fear the WG gives them. We've already seen that Kaido, Big Mom, Whitebeard, and even Shanks are willing to use resources for a good enough cause, or even no good cause at all. Kaido and Big Mom would rather not fight, but they will if they piss each other off. Shanks was willing to fight the Marines if they didn't end the war. Whitebeard literally sacrificed his entire crew for Ace. They don't care about resources as much as you are saying. Even the Marines themselves send forces to take down Shichibukai, and if them never wanting to lose resources was true, they would have just let the Shichibukai, who have helped them for years, just roam around without actually engaging them, especially Mihawk, who is the reason Shanks is a Yonko.
tl:dr your post and points are much more easily explained by saying 1 Yonko is almost equal to, but slightly weaker than Shichibukai+Marines.
You are literally arguieng against canon manga as well as databook facts.
Garp has stated within the manga that Marines allied themselved with pirates (Shichibukai) to counterbalance the Yonko.
In Databook Green "Secret Pieces" it is stated that Marine HQ + Shichibukai equals the Yonko.
The word Yonko means "4 Emperors".
After this you just need to think logically to come to the conclusion whether he means all of them combined or all of them individually.
Which is your point... you believe Garp meant each yonko individually.
But if you were capable of applying logic you would realize there is no way he could mean that.
Each of the yonko has their own territories, armies, motives etc... which the marines oversee and monitor constantly in order to be prepared for whatever they are doing.
One Piece is not a turn based RPG...
It's not like one of the yonko makes a move which the marines then could make a move against and then another one of the yonko makes a move and so on...
The marines need to be on high alert constantly in case ANY of the yonko makes a move that he shouldn't be doing.
Throughout the years the yonko have made and still to this day activaly make moves within the new world and the marines have to take care of all of it combined.
Marine HQ allied themselves with powerful pirates (Shichibukai) in order to counterbalance the influence and power all of the yonko hold within the new world at the same time.
Also don't forget that there is another HUGE part of the world (Paradise) which the Marines also control with other forces that have little to do with Marine HQ.
During Marineford War it was stated that 100k Elite Navy soldiers gathered but it was never stated whether those were all of their Elite forces let alone ALL of their forces.
Oda even made a statement in one of the SBS about how ONLY Elite Marines gathered at Marineford and others didn't, which means Marine HQ are not representive of all of the Marines forces to begin with.
Marine HQ + Shichibukai are simply taking responsibility for the New World specifically.
They're not "beating" the Yonko and their crew. As the CP0 have said in one of the latest chapters, they heard that King got defeated by Zoro, yet they also say that him getting defeated is completely meaningless as long as the Yonkos themselves are alive.
The Strawhats are nowhere near enough to beat them. And even if they do, the Marines getting taken down by the current Strawhats isn't contradicting anything. Later on, the someone like Imu or Blackbeard could become the actual threat the Strawhats have to face, not the Marines. There are infinite possibilities. The Marines don't have to be that much stronger than the Yonkos.
2 Yonko needing Ancient Weapons is not disproving anything. Not only do they need to take down the WG, they also need to fight the other Emperors, who could also be making their own alliance.
Post automatically merged:
I would rather have wrong people know that they're wrong. Your "hero" if you will.
Your opening post addresses none of my stuff. NONE. In fact, my comment is a RESPONSE to your BS. It is clear that you have not read anything because
A) You claim that I repeated points when I didn't
B) You claim you responded to me when you didn't
C) You're continuing to run away from me while claiming things that didn't happen.
And there is no strawman, you're just being proven wrong. You said that Marines+Shichibukai COULD take out the Yonko, and you even state "Never did the Marines say that they couldn't take down the Emperors"
Akainu never stating they couldn't handle it is not proof of anything. That's just his pride. Just like Big Mom and Kaido's pride about the Marines being weak or whatever. They're all BS and not true. Them dealing with other incidents just made the already hard situation even harder.
Kaido never freaked out, you're making shit up.
See? I already addressed most of these and debunked them, yet you keep mentioning them. None of my arguments were EVER addressed. I'll ask you to give me a SINGLE argument of mine that you've addressed. JUST ONE. How tf are you a moderator?
Let me state this for the millionth time. All your "points" are much more easily explained by a 5 way stalemate. You have to delve into headcanon and mental gymnastics to interpret it in a way that is Marines+Shichibukai=>Yonko or some shit like this.
I never said Marine+Shichibukai>Yonko, something you claimed I did. That is a strawman.
It is canon fact that Akainu and others stated that the Marines' resources are spread thin and can't deal with the Emperor alliance at the moment because of it. Even Brannew said it but your argument is that canon info means nothing cause it's just Akainu's pride.
Kaido was literally screaming at his men to stop the BMP and gave a sigh of relief when King got rid of them. That is a fact and just say "No" and that you debunked it.
Guess what? You're still using old arguments with less post quality. Bring something new. Once again, it's called the 3 Great Powers, not your made up 6 powers.
Warlords ~ 1 Yonko crew
I’m pretty confident Marines are > 2 yonko crews
When 3 yonko crews combine forces that’s when things get blurry (maybe 3 yonkos>~Marines) and I’ll say that definitely
4 yonkos>Marines
Seems like the notion that the Marines+Warlords = 1 Emperor is more and more nonsense as we see the battle of Onigashima.
From what look like the WB Pirates were stronger than the BM and Kaido crews, just look at what Marco alone was able to do.
I agree with the OP, that the Marines can defeat a emperor and his crew, but that would cause so much instability that there's no reason to do that.
The War in MF was a exeption as the Gorosei knew that Ace was Joy Boy material, so much more than fighting WB, they wanted to show force by killing Ace, pehaps if in Ace place was Jozu or any other WB crewmate, the governament would try some kind of deal behind the scenes with WB to set he free without making the WG look like the loser and avoiding spend soo much resources in a War.
Marco's versatility and support in battle can be matched by Cracker's endless biscuit soldiers and Queen's viruses. WB Pirates are nothing special compared to the other Yonko crews.
Can’t wait final war where luffy and his army are stronger gear than all 4 emperor combined. And he has ancient weapons with his side. Then luffy force still extremely diff fight against world government force.
Marco's versatility and support in battle can be matched by Cracker's endless biscuit soldiers and Queen's viruses. WB Pirates are nothing special compared to the other Yonko crews.
Because they had homefield advantage with all the traps and buildings they set up in anticipation of Whitebeard arriving, strategic advantage with Sengoku tricking Squad to injuring Whitebeard, Whitebeard himself being weakened due to a heart attack, multiple injuries prior the battle, suffering injuries during the battle from cheap shots from Admirals, the Admirals using openings caused by Whitebeard's fall to take out the Commanders like Jozu, Vista and Marco, Whitebeard not using Adv CoC, 3 of his powerful Commander/strong crew members being out of his crew (Blackbeard, Ace, Thatch). And overall, the Whitebeard Pirates only had 2 major losses, those being Ace and Whitebeard himself. The Whitebeard Pirates themselves were still powerful enough later on that Blackbeard defeating them earned him the title of Yonko.
Whitebeard Pirates had so many disadvantages compared to the Marines, most notably, Whitebeard himself being so much weaker than he was supposed to be. Look at my previous reply for a good list of all the troubles they had. They may be wiped out, but had they had equal conditions, the Marines would have had so much more troubles and it would have been a more even match.
Post automatically merged:
You are literally arguieng against canon manga as well as databook facts.
You are the one ignoring the context behind those statements. And the only thing I am arguing against is your interpretation of those facts.
Garp has stated within the manga that Marines allied themselved with pirates (Shichibukai) to counterbalance the Yonko.
Yes, that was stated. The context behind that, we later find out, is that Marines+Shichibukai=>1 Yonko alone.
In Databook Green "Secret Pieces" it is stated that Marine HQ + Shichibukai equals the Yonko.
The word Yonko means "4 Emperors".
Again, ignoring context. Every single time the word Yonko is used, it has multiple definitions. Sometimes they mean just ONE of the Four Emperors, whereas sometimes, they refer to them as a group. Jinbei, for example, states "I cannot be scared by a mere Yonko." whereas Garp's statement on the Yonko talks about them as a group. Not in the sense that Yonko=Marines+Shichibukai, of course. Just that the Marines+Shichibukai are more powerful than any Yonko crew by itself, and that is how they keep the balance.
After this you just need to think logically to come to the conclusion whether he means all of them combined or all of them individually. Which is your point... you believe Garp meant each yonko individually. But if you were capable of applying logic you would realize there is no way he could mean that.
I already read what you posted past here, and it's like saying "1+1=2, therefore, I am the smartest man alive." You do not provide any evidence for the claim you made here.
Each of the yonko has their own territories, armies, motives etc... which the marines oversee and monitor constantly in order to be prepared for whatever they are doing. One Piece is not a turn based RPG... It's not like one of the yonko makes a move which the marines then could make a move against and then another one of the yonko makes a move and so on... The marines need to be on high alert constantly in case ANY of the yonko makes a move that he shouldn't be doing. Throughout the years the yonko have made and still to this day activaly make moves within the new world and the marines have to take care of all of it combined. Marine HQ allied themselves with powerful pirates (Shichibukai) in order to counterbalance the influence and power all of the yonko hold within the new world at the same time.
Also don't forget that there is another HUGE part of the world (Paradise) which the Marines also control with other forces that have little to do with Marine HQ. During Marineford War it was stated that 100k Elite Navy soldiers gathered but it was never stated whether those were all of their Elite forces let alone ALL of their forces. Oda even made a statement in one of the SBS about how ONLY Elite Marines gathered at Marineford and others didn't, which means Marine HQ are not representive of all of the Marines forces to begin with. Marine HQ + Shichibukai are simply taking responsibility for the New World specifically.
I fail to find a single piece of evidence here that means Marines+Shichibukai=All Yonko combined. None of this shit is relevant. You basically just said "Well, Marines have more soldiers, and they use Shichibukai and the 100 thousand soldiers together to take care of the Yonko, so that must mean all of them combined are evenly matched to each other."
Your point about the RPG would still make sense if each of the Yonko are almost as powerful and strong as the Marines+Shichibukai.
The Marines are not in need of counterbalancing ALL of the Yonko, I addressed this like 50 times already. They just need to be INDIVIDUALLY stronger than ANY individual Yonko to keep the world at a stalemate.
I never said Marine+Shichibukai>Yonko, something you claimed I did. That is a strawman.
It is canon fact that Akainu and others stated that the Marines' resources are spread thin and can't deal with the Emperor alliance at the moment because of it. Even Brannew said it but your argument is that canon info means nothing cause it's just Akainu's pride.
Kaido was literally screaming at his men to stop the BMP and gave a sigh of relief when King got rid of them. That is a fact and just say "No" and that you debunked it.
Guess what? You're still using old arguments with less post quality. Bring something new. Once again, it's called the 3 Great Powers, not your made up 6 powers.
And we're finished....TL;DR, Marines+Shichibukai~Emperors combined. Postskip Marines alone~Emperors combined. It's not always about Yonko-Admiral power levels.....
Do you not see this? I can give you props by saying you didn't say they were stronger, just around equal. Either way, that statement is problematic and untrue, with your constant context ignoring lying self just continuing to spout nonsense.
For Akainu, READ my replies ffs. Akainu and the Marines CANNOT handle them, and the Shichibukai disbanding made the already dire situation worse. You took Akainu never stating that they cannot handle them and them having a hard time right now because of the Shichibukai and then took it to mean they CAN handle them if they weren't dealing with the Shichibukai, which is such a logical leap.
When Kaido and BM joined hands, Akainu never said they couldn't handle it. He directly said that they were already busy and spread thin dealing with other incidents.
You go from "Akainu never stated they couldn't handle them" to "Which means Akainu think they COULD handle them". You're making shit up and making baseless assumptions.
Plus, the fact that merely 7 Pirates, aside from Mihawk, who are NOWHERE NEAR Yonko level are causing enough problems for the Marines that they cannot handle just 2 Yonko, when you were claiming the Marines are around as strong as all the Yonko combined is just dumb. If they were that powerful, then dealing with 2 Yonko should be a piece of cake, since they just sent weak foot soldiers against the Shichibukai themselves, meaning the main Marine forces, the Admirals, are still there.
Kaido would just rather not deal with them. This is not the same as being frightened or whatever you're saying.
Freaked out=/=just not wanting to fight someone who would be an annoyance. Again, you're making shit up. There, debunked.
It is the 6 Great Powers unless you prove otherwise without ignoring the context behind the 3 Great Powers. Not a SINGLE time did you ever debunk this and just said "3 means 3, so that means 3." The Yonkos stalemate each other. This automatically disproves this 3 Great Powers just being the end all be all.
And guess what? Even if my arguments are old, they're still valid.
Do you know why you should exercise? The argument as to why you should exercise has NEVER changed. It's just good for you, and that argument is still valid. Are you going to tell people who tell you to exercise that their argument is old, and thus invalid? You're literally doing the exact same thing here. You NEVER addressed my arguments.
This statement right here by Doffy confirms that it is possible for ONE SINGULAR EMPEROR to rule the seas, whereas the Navy together are said to rule it now, yet that balance can be ruined just ONE YONKO. There is no discussion with this.
This Yonko=Shichibukai+Marines BS needs to end.
Amazing post, was a really good read and I think it's just generally a good addition to the community, something to refer to in the future instead of arguing myself xD
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
