Capitalism vs Communism
- Thread starter TepesIII
- Start date
You defined communism as "workers control of production" and then you named USSR as your example and you can't ee the contradiction in your comments? You and I are in America, so if you want to define communism in the traditional, classical sense which was socialism then go ahead. However, we are in 2022 and not in Europe and Americans define communism as "state control of production". This isn't the year 1900 in Europe, where socialism and communism were interchangeable terms. Like I said, you are playing semantic games.
okay so I'm finally off work and can quote better, let's see what I said?
I didn't name the USSR as an example, I literally asked you explain the USSR's name because it comes from a very key tenet of communism which unions controlling the means of production. Wether they followed through with it or not was irrelevant
Who does? Economist and historians clearly don't. This is as silly as saying socialism is state control of production because in practice that's what happens
"Communism is a specific, yet distinct, form of socialism. Communists usually seek a voluntary state of self-governance, but disagree on the means to this end, reflecting a distinction between a more libertarian approach of communization, revolutionary spontaneity, and workers' self-management, and a more vanguardist or Communist party-driven approach through the development of a constitutional socialist state followed by Marx's withering away of the state. "
Communism is a form of socialism by definition. Dude it's literally fine to admit you were wrong, it's actually a sign of maturity
I didn't name the USSR as an example, I literally asked you explain the USSR's name because it comes from a very key tenet of communism which unions controlling the means of production. Wether they followed through with it or not was irrelevant
Who does? Economist and historians clearly don't. This is as silly as saying socialism is state control of production because in practice that's what happens
"Communism is a specific, yet distinct, form of socialism. Communists usually seek a voluntary state of self-governance, but disagree on the means to this end, reflecting a distinction between a more libertarian approach of communization, revolutionary spontaneity, and workers' self-management, and a more vanguardist or Communist party-driven approach through the development of a constitutional socialist state followed by Marx's withering away of the state. "
Communism is a form of socialism by definition. Dude it's literally fine to admit you were wrong, it's actually a sign of maturity
Communism itself has the claim of being utopian; the state which society achieves through common consensus, in which the state itself becomes obsolete. Hence any attempt to forcefully establish it, will turn into a rather totalitarian state. Hence, yeah, capitalism is better, as communism is a highly theoretical construct unable to being realistically implemented. But fortunately, there are not only the two extremes of turbo-capitalism and communism.
How can the idea not work in practice if it’s never been practiced? That’s like saying Democracy doesn’t work in practice because North Korea.
A stateless, classless, moneyless society would solve 99% of the world’s problems, I don’t think we should stop striving for such an ideal goal just because people are too scared of pretend communism to realize an ideal future.
A stateless, classless, moneyless society would solve 99% of the world’s problems, I don’t think we should stop striving for such an ideal goal just because people are too scared of pretend communism to realize an ideal future.
It is important if they followed through with it or not. That is the whole point. Just saying youre a socialist doesn't make you one which is my whole point about Lenin being a politician and using socialism to exploit the population. North Korea has democracy in it's name, does that mean it is democratically elected?
Doing something that is contradictory "in practice" is still a contradiction. If you don't implement the core tenents of socialism then it is not socialism. It is that simple. Also, we are not historians. We are in a manga site and the common American defines communism as "state control of production". That is what communism means in America.
Exactly, "communism is a specific yet DISTINCT form of socialism". Again, for the hundredth time, you are playing semantics. I defined communism in the MODERN American form. You are grasping for technicalities and saying "you see you are wrong because they are technically the same" . That wasn't my point at all. You are aruing over something that is totally irrelevant to the context of my post. My point was to define what the difference is between the three forms of capitalism, socialism and communism. If you want to get technical and put communism in the same form as socialism, then go ahead that is fine but that wasn't my point at all.
Doing something that is contradictory "in practice" is still a contradiction. If you don't implement the core tenents of socialism then it is not socialism. It is that simple. Also, we are not historians. We are in a manga site and the common American defines communism as "state control of production". That is what communism means in America.
Exactly, "communism is a specific yet DISTINCT form of socialism". Again, for the hundredth time, you are playing semantics. I defined communism in the MODERN American form. You are grasping for technicalities and saying "you see you are wrong because they are technically the same" . That wasn't my point at all. You are aruing over something that is totally irrelevant to the context of my post. My point was to define what the difference is between the three forms of capitalism, socialism and communism. If you want to get technical and put communism in the same form as socialism, then go ahead that is fine but that wasn't my point at all.
Again, I never used them as an example, I literally just used their name to show you what communism is. On Lenin? again you clearly show the lack of reading on him.
A lot of Americans also think socialism is communism but you're bitching at me.
This doesn't exist, either understand what communism is or just don't talk about it
A lot of Americans also think socialism is communism but you're bitching at me.
This doesn't exist, either understand what communism is or just don't talk about it
Not many people know that Karl Marx communism idea is from age of the enlightenment view point.
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/smith-cyril/works/articles/interim.htm
In fact, some native Americans tribes alrrady have communism like idea before Karl Marx is born.
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/smith-cyril/works/articles/interim.htm
In fact, some native Americans tribes alrrady have communism like idea before Karl Marx is born.