Controversial General Political Discussion

[RyoQ]

Yes but if abortion is legal, then its not murder

Using this logic, if stabbing random people was legal, then it wouldn't be murder

Of course, you can see why this logic fails. The definition for murder does not distinguish between the 2 types of laws that exist, those being the universal or natural law which is universal, unchanging and accessible to human reason...and the man-made law which, to varying degrees, reflects the natural law

Inasmuch as a man-made law fails to reflect the natural law, it ceases to be a law at all. Hence a law allowing citizens to randomly stab each other isn't a law at all

Similarly, abortion being legal is not a law at all, because murder or any evil can never be "legal" in the universal sense of the word

 

[Brush D. Teeth]

Not in America

People were shot in a Christian school just a couple of weeks ago.

 

[RyoQ]

I kinda agree with logiko on this one ironically

A human is a rational animal. This rationality that human have is what makes us substantially superior to irrational, inhuman creatures.

All animals are substantially similar, humans are substantially above animals because animals do not have rationality whereas humans do

Again, this is not a gradual difference but a substantial one, animals do not have "less" rationality but none at all, whereas all humans have rationality (in varying degrees).

 

[Zenos7]

Using this logic, if stabbing random people was legal, then it wouldn't be murder

It wouldnt.
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The definition for murder does not distinguish between the 2 types of laws that exist, those being the universal or natural law which is universal, unchanging and accessible to human reason...and the man-made law which, to varying degrees, reflects the natural law

There is no universal law wtf.

 

[RyoQ]

It wouldnt

Would it be a justified killing of a human? It's not murder after all, so it's justified?

There is no universal law wtf

What makes something good or evil, inherently? Is anything good or evil inherently?

There is an order all things participate in by their very nature, this is their form. For example the form of a pencil is to write, the form of a lion is that it's a large cat that is carnivorous etc.

The form of things defines what is good and not good, or evil, for it. In that all things have a form, which determines what is good for it, there is a universal "law"

 

[Roo]

lmao logiko really made germinator look like socrates

I may not agree with the guy but he does seem to have a strong foundation for his belief, or at least understands the pro life philosophy enough to argue for it.

 

[Bisoromi Bear]

How China infiltrates Taiwan and the rest of the world

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c878evdp758o

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c3dx1yzzerlo

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c86w2evj05do

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c86w2evj05do

 

[Monkey D Theories]

People were shot in a Christian school just a couple of weeks ago.

Yeah by a girl who went to that school

Anti-Christian discrimination doesn’t exist in the west

I’m not “playing the victim” by pointing out that there seem to be a considerable amount of white supremacists in America who seem to want to kill Indians.

 

[Brush D. Teeth]

Yeah by a girl who went to that school



Anti-Christian discrimination doesn’t exist in the west



I’m not “playing the victim” by pointing out that there seem to be a considerable amount of white supremacists in America who seem to want to kill Indians.

Not really Christian, she seems to have been an anarcho-psycho cunt or something, also another Christian school had a shooting last year.
Oh by the way guess what: https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2024/feb/20/attacks-on-us-churches-more-than-doubled-in-2023-f/

 

[K!NG HARA$H!MA]

As expected, US intensifying bombing of ISIS stronghold in Syria come with a price.


US should withdraw and meditate between SDF and Turkey to handle Isis so that the battle doesn't spillover to US soils

 

[Monkey D Theories]

Not really Christian, she seems to have been an anarcho-psycho cunt or something, also another Christian school had a shooting last year.
Oh by the way guess what: https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2024/feb/20/attacks-on-us-churches-more-than-doubled-in-2023-f/

still school shootings happen across America. Not necessarily anti-Christian.

As for that link, I do wonder what the motivation behind much of those attacks actually were. One example it mentions, an attack on a black church, is much more likely a racist attack than anti-Christian.

In any case I am very skeptical about that research institute. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_Research_Council
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America is ultimately a Christian majority country and Christian influenced laws have been implemented throughout the nation.

bans on abortion
School choice
Even laws requiring the 10 commandments being shown in classrooms

Christians are not persecuted in America

 

[Brush D. Teeth]

still school shootings happen across America. Not necessarily anti-Christian.

As for that link, I do wonder what the motivation behind much of those attacks actually were. One example it mentions, an attack on a black church, is much more likely a racist attack than anti-Christian.

In any case I am very skeptical about that research institute. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_Research_Council
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America is ultimately a Christian majority country and Christian influenced laws have been implemented throughout the nation.

bans on abortion
School choice
Even laws requiring the 10 commandments being shown in classrooms

Christians are not persecuted in America

Christians are often hated by atheists/lefties/Jews/Muslims and even Indians as I have shown, so it's not a stretch to think these attacks are based on ideology, as the shooting at the school last year was (trans activist I think?).

 

[Zenos7]

Would it be a justified killing of a human? It's not murder after all, so it's justified?

Im not exactly opposed to abortion, but i dont have a proper answer on this.

I dont care about the legal status per se though. Even if it was illegal i wouldn't be opposed to abortion

 

[Monkey D Theories]

Christians are often hated by atheists/lefties/Jews/Muslims and even Indians as I have shown, so it's not a stretch to think these attacks are based on ideology, as the shooting at the school last year was (trans activist I think?).

Christian hate in America is marginal

https://www.justice.gov/crs/highlights/2022-hate-crime-statistics

Most religious hate crimes are against Jews, followed by Muslims and Sikhs.

I do believe that trans person was again, a former student. Maybe it was anti Christian, or maybe they just hated their school like the countless other school shooters.

 

[Zenos7]

What makes something good or evil, inherently? Is anything good or evil inherently?

There is an order all things participate in by their very nature, this is their form. For example the form of a pencil is to write, the form of a lion is that it's a large cat that is carnivorous etc.

The form of things defines what is good and not good, or evil, for it. In that all things have a form, which determines what is good for it, there is a universal "law"

I dont think that even if this universal law would be a thing, none of us would conclusively know. Considering the vast differences among various human cultures and their values i think thats fair.

 

[Brush D. Teeth]

Christian hate in America is marginal

https://www.justice.gov/crs/highlights/2022-hate-crime-statistics

Most religious hate crimes are against Jews, followed by Muslims and Sikhs.

I do believe that trans person was again, a former student. Maybe it was anti Christian, or maybe they just hated their school like the countless other school shooters.

Your argument is pretty dumb. Not sure if that person used to be a student, however that doesn't mean that they didn't hate the group they committed terrorism against. And again you go on and on crying victimhood.

 

[RyoQ]

Im not exactly opposed to abortion, but i dont have a proper answer on this.

If we could conclusively say abortion is the end of a human life, then all arguments for abortion ought be juxtaposed with that fact. Ultimately you will find it is always a killing of convenience, a murder

I dont think that even if this universal law would be a thing, none of us would conclusively know

Calling it a "universal law", is really just a fancy, perhaps misleading given what people think of when they hear "law", way of describing this fact:

All things that exist, have a form, which determines what is the final end for said thing, and this "end" determines what is good/bad for it.

For example, the form of a lion is to be carnivorous, a final end which is realized perfectly whenever lions eat meat; the form of a dog is to have 4 legs, so a dog with 3 legs necessarily "fails" in this respect so it is a "less perfect" dog

Everything that exists has a form, and so within every thing that exists there is a "perfect" degree of it's aspects.

As rational creatures, humans have a final end to always choose what is rational. This is what is meant by "universal" law, this principle which humans have as an end of their nature to always do what is good

This universal obligation humans have to perform good actions, is a truth related to the form or essence of the thing (humans), just as 2+2=4 is a necessary truth related to the very form of 2 + 2 equaling 4

And so it is a conceptual truth we can know by reason alone, it cannot be proved by observation of cultures or any data. It is a fact based on the form of the thing, like 2 + 2 = 4

 

[Monkey D Theories]

. And again you go on and on crying victimhood.

Why am I crying victimhood when I point out that most religious hate crimes in the US are against minorities

But you aren’t crying victimhood when you bring up anti Christian discrimination, which by all measures is marginal in the US.

 

[Ravagerblade]

Never Trust. Follow the Money. Evil People.

 

[Zenos7]

we could conclusively say abortion is the end of a human life, then all arguments for abortion ought be juxtaposed with that fact. Ultimately you will find it is always a killing of convenience, a murder

In most cases yeah, its due to convenience.