So I like Shanks I really do and this isn't an attempt to downplay Shanks but to calm down his wank just a little bit. I don't mean to have @Red Admiral go crazy once again and start wishing deaths on Zoro fans lol (Jk bro I like you) but I think the wank is getting just a tad bit out of control.
I think Shanks conqueror's Haki is strong, obviously one of the strongest in the World but to suggest he has strongest conqueror's Haki of all time and no one besides Roger and Xebec even comes close doesn't sit well with me.
I have following issues with Shanks having strongest Conqueror's Haki of all time and even same level as Roger's
Just look at what conqueror's Haki actually is
Shanks doesn't have Gol D Roger's Ambition
As Rayleigh describes it, one of the biggest aspects of Conqueror's Haki is changing the world, associating it with the ambition. I always fail to understand what Shanks ambition is. What has he truly done besides becoming an emperor?
And becoming an emperor is great but following long list of people have done that as well
-Whitebeard
-Kaido
-Big Mom
-Blackbeard
-Buggy
-Luffy
It seems to be about as common as Warlord these days and apparently it is not very hard to become an emperor for a top tier either as Mihawk recently just casually rejected the yonko title and to get Yonko title he just had to kill Buggy
Pirate King title how ever has been portrayed as end all be all of all the Pirate ambitions. Everyone wants to be Pirate King, all four Yonko are in the race to be Pirate King, as a matter of fact the latest chapter shows even Shanks himself is trying to get One Piece. Well is he gonna get it? Lets see.
Shanks Swordsmanship is Surpassed by Mihawk's
Well this one Shanks fans really not gonna like because for years they have been struggling to separate Haki from Swordsmanship and create a non existent idea of Hakimanship but reality is Haki and Swordsmanship goes hand in hand.
It can't be denied that Shanks has been confirmed a swordsman by Oda himself unlike King and unlike King Shanks doesn't have a devil fruit
A swordsman has to be a Hakiman and as the manga progresses, we learn more and more important things that are needed to become Strongest Swordsman in the World through Zoro's journey and the biggest development as a Swordsmanship that Zoro has learned is King of Hell
King of Hell is the powerup based entirely on Zoro incorporating Advanced Conqueror's Haki with his blades to make his attack power stronger and his blades more durable. Zoro's Haki was much stronger than King's and that's why when Zoro's Haki clashed with King's Haki coated Sword, King's sword broke into two pieces. If Shanks conqueror's Haki is superior to Mihawk's, when both of them go all out with their Haki and thier blades clash, Mihawk's Yoru would break. And if Shanks can break Yoru then Mihawk's swordsmanship doesn't surpass Shanks and Mihawk is not the strongest Swordsman in the World.
Not to mention Mihawk's ambition is superior, his title is superior and having grand ambition is one of the biggest aspect of Conqueror's Haki
Rayleigh has made bigger name for himself than Shanks
It is another manga fact that Straw Hats had no idea who Yonko and Admirals were, they didn't even know the concept of Yonko title and Luffy knows Shanks only because I mean he's met him as a kid
The point about Rayleigh being more famous than Admirals is irrelevant to the thread but prove is they didn't know who Aokiji was, who Kizaru was or what being an Admiral truly means. I think they learned that shit from Nico Robin but either way this is thread about Shanks
Rayleigh name is known by all Straw hats, his name is known in all the books of history
And it isn't just Rayleigh riding Roger's Coattails, no one knows Oden or Marco, Whitebeard's RHM candidates, no one knows Crocus, Oden not being known by Straw hats is also a double W for Rayleigh because he traveled with Roger as well.
And considering Zoro's bounty is 1/3rd of Luffy's I am not even sure how much clout Ray is getting from Roger' name. Thing is Rayleigh played a huge part in changing the world as Roger's partner as Roger asked him to. Roger would no be pirate king without his right hand man.
They have gone around the World, they have attained knowledge of void century and Rayleigh has accumulated such a name value that an Emperor shivers and sweats in his pre
sence when he is 80 years old, completely retired and no where near his Prime.
He can order a Yonko around and Marines around to leave the Island and they obey him.
Such is the name The Dark King has made for himself
It doesn't help that to put a cap on this all, Oda himself thinks Old and Rusty Rayleigh's Conqueror's Haki compares to Shanks. Again his Haki at that age must be no where near his Prime
Shanks doesn't command the kinda people that Rocks D Xebec does
I mean same thing applies to Roger as well, Rayleigh's worth alone is more than worth of Benn Beckman and rest of Red Hair pirates combined but one crew that is head and shoulders above Shanks is Rocks Pirates.
Rocks has who's who of One Piece Pirate History in his crew
And one of the aspects of Conqueror's Haki is to make strong people follow you. No one in history done it the way Rocks has. Well Buggy is exception to that rule of course
Kaido uses Roger as an Example of Peak CoC
So Shanks has fought Kaido and we know that as he has Shanks among 5 people who can fight him
But he never separated Shanks Conqueror's Haki from Oden's, he never suggested Shanks can do any more damage to him than Oden can.
He how ever went out of his way to highlight Gol D Roger's Conqueror's Haki
SOME RED HAIR FAN ARGUMENTS
"Shanks is always associated with his Conqueror's Haki and he's shown it in chapter 1"
Umm yeah sure but don't look at things from tunnel vision, yes Shanks was showing Haki in chapter 1 but he was literally introduced in chapter 1. Of course he is associate with Haki but he's not the only one.
First piece of action Silver's Rayleigh did and it was literally in his introduction chapter was Flex his conqueror's Haki while he was in chains
First thing Gol D Roger did was show people use of Advanced Conqueror's Haki
"Oda used Shanks to show Conqueror's Haki to users"
Yes and he used Silver's Rayleigh to teach Conqueror's Haki not just to Luffy but to readers as well. We understand what Conqueror's Haki is now through Silvers Rayleigh
"Shanks has the best feats of CoC"
Well I say that is debatable at best. I don't know how useful Shanks going all out with his CoC and giving an Admiral a vibration at best is in combat, but we literally haven't seen Mihawk go all out with his Haki, Rayleigh go all out with his Haki, Bajrang Gun, Roger vs Whitebeard etc was showing more CoC Potency.
There are many different aspects of CoC and just one feat doesn't shown anything.
How do you know Rayleigh can't do that?
Roger can't do that?
Conclusion
I think all and all Shanks has a very strong Haki, probably top 5 of all time but I don't think he has the strongest Haki
I think at least following people have stronger CoC than him
-Roger
-Xebec
-Rayleigh
-Mihawk
Few other people who potentially surpass him are Dragon, Garp, Ryuma and Joy Boy
@Gol D. Roger
@TheAncientCenturion
@Jiihad
@Natalija
@AL sama
@Pantheos
@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung
@SakazOuki
@MarineHQ
@silverfire
@Sentinel
@Garp the Fist
@Fenaker
@Gensui Sazid
@HA001
@ConquistadoR
@Shanal
Etc
Sorry forgot to tag Sanji fans
@Kurozumi Chrono
@kurwa
@SkySanji
@MonsterZoro
@Vinsmoke D. Zolo
Idk who else
I think Shanks conqueror's Haki is strong, obviously one of the strongest in the World but to suggest he has strongest conqueror's Haki of all time and no one besides Roger and Xebec even comes close doesn't sit well with me.
I have following issues with Shanks having strongest Conqueror's Haki of all time and even same level as Roger's
Just look at what conqueror's Haki actually is
Shanks doesn't have Gol D Roger's Ambition
As Rayleigh describes it, one of the biggest aspects of Conqueror's Haki is changing the world, associating it with the ambition. I always fail to understand what Shanks ambition is. What has he truly done besides becoming an emperor?
And becoming an emperor is great but following long list of people have done that as well
-Whitebeard
-Kaido
-Big Mom
-Blackbeard
-Buggy
-Luffy
It seems to be about as common as Warlord these days and apparently it is not very hard to become an emperor for a top tier either as Mihawk recently just casually rejected the yonko title and to get Yonko title he just had to kill Buggy
Pirate King title how ever has been portrayed as end all be all of all the Pirate ambitions. Everyone wants to be Pirate King, all four Yonko are in the race to be Pirate King, as a matter of fact the latest chapter shows even Shanks himself is trying to get One Piece. Well is he gonna get it? Lets see.
Shanks Swordsmanship is Surpassed by Mihawk's
Well this one Shanks fans really not gonna like because for years they have been struggling to separate Haki from Swordsmanship and create a non existent idea of Hakimanship but reality is Haki and Swordsmanship goes hand in hand.
It can't be denied that Shanks has been confirmed a swordsman by Oda himself unlike King and unlike King Shanks doesn't have a devil fruit
A swordsman has to be a Hakiman and as the manga progresses, we learn more and more important things that are needed to become Strongest Swordsman in the World through Zoro's journey and the biggest development as a Swordsmanship that Zoro has learned is King of Hell
King of Hell is the powerup based entirely on Zoro incorporating Advanced Conqueror's Haki with his blades to make his attack power stronger and his blades more durable. Zoro's Haki was much stronger than King's and that's why when Zoro's Haki clashed with King's Haki coated Sword, King's sword broke into two pieces. If Shanks conqueror's Haki is superior to Mihawk's, when both of them go all out with their Haki and thier blades clash, Mihawk's Yoru would break. And if Shanks can break Yoru then Mihawk's swordsmanship doesn't surpass Shanks and Mihawk is not the strongest Swordsman in the World.
Not to mention Mihawk's ambition is superior, his title is superior and having grand ambition is one of the biggest aspect of Conqueror's Haki
So if we actually pay attention to subtleties in manga, even before the time skip, the title of World's Strongest Swordsman has consistently been placed on a higher pedestal than the title of Emperor of the Sea and Chapter 1058 reinforced that idea in multiple ways.
To set the stage we have to go to chapter 1033:
There are only two confirmed Kingly Ambitions: Pirate King and World's Strongest Swordsman
Well this isn't the first time Mihawk's and Roger's titles have been paralleled, one of the very first chapters of Manga setting the stage for what is to come has Zoro and Luffy's ambitions outlined in the title of a chapter
It also needs to be noted that Zoro was substitute for Luffy's head against Kuma when Zoro told Kuma he will one day become strongest swordsman in the world. That is surely a sufficient replacement, aka head of World's Strongest Swordsman is enough to consider sparing head of Pirate King. Sanji made some bullshit up about most trouble some because obviously finding all blue holds no value to anyone but Sanji and few other chefs.
"You have such an Ambition" : Said Mihawk's Fellow Warlord and Really Dragon's former Right Hand man. And obviously Kuma is willing to take Zoro's head.
Now we know what the perception of title of World's Strongest Swordsman is to a Warlord in comparison to Pirate king title. A title holder whose head is sufficient replacement for for Pirate King's title.
its only fair we must also look at how a warlord or in this case former warlord perceives Yonko title in comparison to Pirate King title
In the hindsight this might seem like just a diss on Big Mom from Jinbei but it runs deeper than that, because that is my real point.Emperor title is obviously worth something just like rank of Admiral is worth something, just like being a warlord is worth something. But it isn't given the level of respect the title of World's Strongest Swordsman is given.
Again remember I am just talking about title in this instance not necessarily title holder because Whitebeard is obviously much more than just an emperor, he is essentially King of an Era.
But chapter 1058 shows World's Strongest title is worth more than Yonko title, as a matter of fact so much more that despite World's Strongest Swordsman supposedly working under an emperor, we are told as such:
Fitting Bounty for Emperor and Mihawk's Captain is 3.19 BillionFitting Bounty for Strongest Swordsman in the World is 3.6 Billion
Which may not seem much but it must also be noted Buggy is the Emperor with second highest bounty currently. The minimum cut out Bounty for Emperor as far as we know is 2.2 Billion
So World's Strongest Swordsman is not only given the distinction of Kingly Ambition, a head that is worthy replacement for the head of Pirate King, but also we are straight up told by Brannew that World's Strongest Swordsman is worth more than an Emperor.
Gotta understand the technicalities too
-An Emperor has to be an emperor for Multiple years, do some crazy shit, have some kinda insane pedigree like Rocks Pirate Cred, a Crazy Strong Crew and then the title is worth something.
Considering Blackbeard at the 2.247 can become an Emperor, minimum cut out for the worth of an emperor is extremely Low.
This isn't necessarily saying Mihawk is above every emperor ever, that is a thread for the future, as there is someone like Whitebeard who is obviously far greater an entity than your average emperor, he is essentially King of an Era and certainly the worthy rival of Pirate King not to mention Strongest Man in the World in his prime.
Also I know some people, Aka Luffy fan boys will get offended over me comparing Pirate King title to WSS
Oh How dare you sword Cuck, Pirate King Superior title Mihawk said its way harder bla bla bla
Okay something harder to achieve isn't necessarily better lol, and secondly context *****
Yes it is harder to find one remote Island across the entire World
Yes it is harder to find someone who can read poneglyphs
Collect all the poneglyphs
Have the entire world going against you
But still this isn't a Pirate King vs WSS comparison, instead WSS vs Emperor comparison and we all know it doesn't take much to become an emperor, all Mihawk has to do is kill a clown to become one
But why would a man who is a King of Swordsman, a title that is someone's kingly ambiton ever go for the title of Mere emperor
@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung
@Cinera
@TheAncientCenturion
@pg13
@Psalm
@Monkey D Theories
@notAfanboy
@Luffywankishere
@Kurozumi Franosuke
@Shanal
@HA001
@Fenaker
@Gensui Sazid
@comrade
@MarineHQ
@grey matter
@ZenZu
@HeroesNZ
@Den_Den_Mushi
@Gol D. Roger
To set the stage we have to go to chapter 1033:
There are only two confirmed Kingly Ambitions: Pirate King and World's Strongest Swordsman
Well this isn't the first time Mihawk's and Roger's titles have been paralleled, one of the very first chapters of Manga setting the stage for what is to come has Zoro and Luffy's ambitions outlined in the title of a chapter
It also needs to be noted that Zoro was substitute for Luffy's head against Kuma when Zoro told Kuma he will one day become strongest swordsman in the world. That is surely a sufficient replacement, aka head of World's Strongest Swordsman is enough to consider sparing head of Pirate King. Sanji made some bullshit up about most trouble some because obviously finding all blue holds no value to anyone but Sanji and few other chefs.
"You have such an Ambition" : Said Mihawk's Fellow Warlord and Really Dragon's former Right Hand man. And obviously Kuma is willing to take Zoro's head.
Now we know what the perception of title of World's Strongest Swordsman is to a Warlord in comparison to Pirate king title. A title holder whose head is sufficient replacement for for Pirate King's title.
its only fair we must also look at how a warlord or in this case former warlord perceives Yonko title in comparison to Pirate King title
In the hindsight this might seem like just a diss on Big Mom from Jinbei but it runs deeper than that, because that is my real point.Emperor title is obviously worth something just like rank of Admiral is worth something, just like being a warlord is worth something. But it isn't given the level of respect the title of World's Strongest Swordsman is given.
Again remember I am just talking about title in this instance not necessarily title holder because Whitebeard is obviously much more than just an emperor, he is essentially King of an Era.
But chapter 1058 shows World's Strongest title is worth more than Yonko title, as a matter of fact so much more that despite World's Strongest Swordsman supposedly working under an emperor, we are told as such:
Fitting Bounty for Emperor and Mihawk's Captain is 3.19 BillionFitting Bounty for Strongest Swordsman in the World is 3.6 Billion
Which may not seem much but it must also be noted Buggy is the Emperor with second highest bounty currently. The minimum cut out Bounty for Emperor as far as we know is 2.2 Billion
So World's Strongest Swordsman is not only given the distinction of Kingly Ambition, a head that is worthy replacement for the head of Pirate King, but also we are straight up told by Brannew that World's Strongest Swordsman is worth more than an Emperor.
Gotta understand the technicalities too
-An Emperor has to be an emperor for Multiple years, do some crazy shit, have some kinda insane pedigree like Rocks Pirate Cred, a Crazy Strong Crew and then the title is worth something.
Considering Blackbeard at the 2.247 can become an Emperor, minimum cut out for the worth of an emperor is extremely Low.
This isn't necessarily saying Mihawk is above every emperor ever, that is a thread for the future, as there is someone like Whitebeard who is obviously far greater an entity than your average emperor, he is essentially King of an Era and certainly the worthy rival of Pirate King not to mention Strongest Man in the World in his prime.
Also I know some people, Aka Luffy fan boys will get offended over me comparing Pirate King title to WSS
Oh How dare you sword Cuck, Pirate King Superior title Mihawk said its way harder bla bla bla
Okay something harder to achieve isn't necessarily better lol, and secondly context *****
Yes it is harder to find one remote Island across the entire World
Yes it is harder to find someone who can read poneglyphs
Collect all the poneglyphs
Have the entire world going against you
But still this isn't a Pirate King vs WSS comparison, instead WSS vs Emperor comparison and we all know it doesn't take much to become an emperor, all Mihawk has to do is kill a clown to become one
But why would a man who is a King of Swordsman, a title that is someone's kingly ambiton ever go for the title of Mere emperor
@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung
@Cinera
@TheAncientCenturion
@pg13
@Psalm
@Monkey D Theories
@notAfanboy
@Luffywankishere
@Kurozumi Franosuke
@Shanal
@HA001
@Fenaker
@Gensui Sazid
@comrade
@MarineHQ
@grey matter
@ZenZu
@HeroesNZ
@Den_Den_Mushi
@Gol D. Roger
It is another manga fact that Straw Hats had no idea who Yonko and Admirals were, they didn't even know the concept of Yonko title and Luffy knows Shanks only because I mean he's met him as a kid
The point about Rayleigh being more famous than Admirals is irrelevant to the thread but prove is they didn't know who Aokiji was, who Kizaru was or what being an Admiral truly means. I think they learned that shit from Nico Robin but either way this is thread about Shanks
Rayleigh name is known by all Straw hats, his name is known in all the books of history
And it isn't just Rayleigh riding Roger's Coattails, no one knows Oden or Marco, Whitebeard's RHM candidates, no one knows Crocus, Oden not being known by Straw hats is also a double W for Rayleigh because he traveled with Roger as well.
And considering Zoro's bounty is 1/3rd of Luffy's I am not even sure how much clout Ray is getting from Roger' name. Thing is Rayleigh played a huge part in changing the world as Roger's partner as Roger asked him to. Roger would no be pirate king without his right hand man.
They have gone around the World, they have attained knowledge of void century and Rayleigh has accumulated such a name value that an Emperor shivers and sweats in his pre
sence when he is 80 years old, completely retired and no where near his Prime.
He can order a Yonko around and Marines around to leave the Island and they obey him.
Such is the name The Dark King has made for himself
It doesn't help that to put a cap on this all, Oda himself thinks Old and Rusty Rayleigh's Conqueror's Haki compares to Shanks. Again his Haki at that age must be no where near his Prime
Shanks doesn't command the kinda people that Rocks D Xebec does
I mean same thing applies to Roger as well, Rayleigh's worth alone is more than worth of Benn Beckman and rest of Red Hair pirates combined but one crew that is head and shoulders above Shanks is Rocks Pirates.
Rocks has who's who of One Piece Pirate History in his crew
And one of the aspects of Conqueror's Haki is to make strong people follow you. No one in history done it the way Rocks has. Well Buggy is exception to that rule of course
Kaido uses Roger as an Example of Peak CoC
So Shanks has fought Kaido and we know that as he has Shanks among 5 people who can fight him
But he never separated Shanks Conqueror's Haki from Oden's, he never suggested Shanks can do any more damage to him than Oden can.
He how ever went out of his way to highlight Gol D Roger's Conqueror's Haki
SOME RED HAIR FAN ARGUMENTS
"Shanks is always associated with his Conqueror's Haki and he's shown it in chapter 1"
Umm yeah sure but don't look at things from tunnel vision, yes Shanks was showing Haki in chapter 1 but he was literally introduced in chapter 1. Of course he is associate with Haki but he's not the only one.
First piece of action Silver's Rayleigh did and it was literally in his introduction chapter was Flex his conqueror's Haki while he was in chains
First thing Gol D Roger did was show people use of Advanced Conqueror's Haki
"Oda used Shanks to show Conqueror's Haki to users"
Yes and he used Silver's Rayleigh to teach Conqueror's Haki not just to Luffy but to readers as well. We understand what Conqueror's Haki is now through Silvers Rayleigh
"Shanks has the best feats of CoC"
Well I say that is debatable at best. I don't know how useful Shanks going all out with his CoC and giving an Admiral a vibration at best is in combat, but we literally haven't seen Mihawk go all out with his Haki, Rayleigh go all out with his Haki, Bajrang Gun, Roger vs Whitebeard etc was showing more CoC Potency.
There are many different aspects of CoC and just one feat doesn't shown anything.
How do you know Rayleigh can't do that?
Roger can't do that?
Conclusion
I think all and all Shanks has a very strong Haki, probably top 5 of all time but I don't think he has the strongest Haki
I think at least following people have stronger CoC than him
-Roger
-Xebec
-Rayleigh
-Mihawk
Few other people who potentially surpass him are Dragon, Garp, Ryuma and Joy Boy
@Gol D. Roger
@TheAncientCenturion
@Jiihad
@Natalija
@AL sama
@Pantheos
@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung
@SakazOuki
@MarineHQ
@silverfire
@Sentinel
@Garp the Fist
@Fenaker
@Gensui Sazid
@HA001
@ConquistadoR
@Shanal
Etc
Post automatically merged:
Sorry forgot to tag Sanji fans
@Kurozumi Chrono
@kurwa
@SkySanji
@MonsterZoro
@Vinsmoke D. Zolo
Idk who else
![[No Name]](https://worstgen.alwaysdata.net/forum/data/avatars/o/8/8045.jpg?1622550034){kind=avatar}
