Zoro scarred Kaido. That was a severely weaken and nerfed Zoro with 20 to 30 broken bones.
Zoro now has mastered enma, taken his CoA to a whole new level with his green aura blackened haki and obtained ACoC which he has taken to a high level.
Look I don't really care about headcanon powerlevels here. My point is it makes more sense for Yamato or Momo to kill Kaido than it does Zoro.
But regardless, if you compare Kaido to before he fought Yamato to after, he clearly took a lot of damage from her. And it wasn't until after he fought Yamato that people remarked he was getting weaker.
This is the problem with peopel who take powerscaling too seriously. They make up headcanon and then act like it's somehow factual.
I already explained to you why the "few drops of blood" is a faulty way to measure her strength and that is the only single piece of evidence you have.
Very interesting.
You still havent provided any logical explanation how Yamato goes from couple of blood drops to killing the unkillable?
There is a YUGE power gap in your logic and neither Momo nor Yamato and certainly not Luffy either can stand a chance at killing Kaido.
Yamato didn't just give him a few drops of blood. There was a single panel that showed Kaido bleeding during the fight and people seem to think that's all she did. If you look at how Kaido was before and after the fight, it's clear he took a lot of damage from Yamato.
But even if all of that wasn't true, it's pretty clear at this point that Oda doesn't really care about consistent powerlevels. Law went from losing to Doflamingo to beating a Yonko in a couple of weeks.
Momo has no chance of joining the crew, if you payed any attention to his character that would be clear. He is not his father, therefore it benefits him nothing to do what Oden wanted to but couldn't, he'll do what Oden didn't want to do which is lead Wano and stay there. Imagine after 20 years of waiting for Momo to return he tells them he'd rather be a pirate, tell me why he's a shoe in to join the crew.
The reason why I think Momo has a chance to join is that it's clear he's not yet ready to be Shogun. He's still mentally a child. He'll probably stay, but I think it would at least make some sense if he decided to tag along up until Laugh Tale.
Yamato isn't even close to the most important in the alliance, hell most of the alliance don't even know who she is. If Oda wanted her to kill Kaido he would have tried harder to make her paramount to the arc, by either causing the majority of the conflict or giving her the sole ability to solve an aspect of the conflict. Think of, you know, any other arc dedicated to strawhats or future strawhats such as w7 and ennies lobby, TB, WCI etc.
Yamato doesn't have the ability to kill Kaido, she may have CoC coating but she isn't a swordsman, and we don't know for a fact what her views on killing are. If she can kill Kaido with blunt damage then so could Luffy, and to make Momo a killer while still mentally being an 8 year old is dumb. Neither of them are killing Kaido, they're not strong or important enough or that's not their character, you can pick one.
Sanji didn't cause the conflict in Baratie and he didn't have the ability to beat Krieg in the end. Hell he couldn't even beat Gin
Not sure how that's supposed to help your argument at all.
But anyway, Yamato and Momo embody the core themes of Wano more than any other character and they're arguably the two "princesses" of the arc. I don't really know how you think they aren't important
Yamato can kill Kaido because she has AdCoC and she's strong enough to fight him 1 on 1 for multiple chapters. It really doesn't matter if she's not a swordsman. Yes, Luffy could do it too, but it would make more narrative sense for it to be Momo or Yamato because they have an actual connection to him. I don't really think Kaido will die, but if he does they will probably kill him.
The "before fighting Yamato" is a cherry picked panel which is probably an inconsistency. Kaidou did not wipe himself clean before transforming within seconds of Yamato picking a fight with him.
Kaidou after fighting Luffy:
Kaidou while hitting Kinemon:
Kaidou while Yamato herself picks a fight with him:
Kaidou was already bruised and bleeding from fighting the Rooftop 5 and then Luffy
Yamato didn't just give him a few drops of blood. There was a single panel that showed Kaido bleeding during the fight and people seem to think that's all she did. If you look at how Kaido was before and after the fight, it's clear he took a lot of damage from Yamato.
But even if all of that wasn't true, it's pretty clear at this point that Oda doesn't really care about consistent powerlevels. Law went from losing to Doflamingo to beating a Yonko in a couple of weeks.
The reason why I think Momo has a chance to join is that it's clear he's not yet ready to be Shogun. He's still mentally a child. He'll probably stay, but I think it would at least make some sense if he decided to tag along up until Laugh Tale.
Sanji didn't cause the conflict in Syrup Village and he didn't have the ability to beat Krieg in the end. Hell he couldn't even beat Gin
Not sure how that's supposed to help your argument at all.
But anyway, Yamato and Momo embody the core themes of Wano more than any other character and they're arguably the two "princesses" of the arc. I don't really know how you think they aren't important
Yamato can kill Kaido because she has AdCoC and she's strong enough to fight him 1 on 1 for multiple chapters. It really doesn't matter if she's not a swordsman. Yes, Luffy could do it too, but it would make more narrative sense for it to be Momo or Yamato because they have an actual connection to him. I don't really think Kaido will die, but if he does they will probably kill him.
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The fact that he was covered with bruises after fighting her
We saw how Momo affects the country of Wano (remember Udon) even whilst being a child, he's going through steps to growing up and into the position he needs to be in. If you think he's too young to be the Shogun what makes you think he can kill somebody?
Sanji didn't cause the conflict in Syrup Village and he didn't have the ability to beat Krieg in the end. Hell he couldn't even beat Gin
Not sure how that's supposed to help your argument at all.
Lmao what the hell are you on about? Sanji wasn't in the story in Syrup village, Usopp was and he had a hand in both causing the conflict (hearing of Kuro's plan) and his relationship to kaya stopped Kuro's plan from working. Then with the Baratie arc Sanji's feeding Gin was a huge incitement of plot, not to mention his backstory given had huge relevance to that. Not everything's about the strength to beat the main antagonist so my argument stands I'm afraid.
Neither have the narrative claim to kill Kaido, being his daughter is hardly reason to kill him. Even looking outside the story, Oda is incredibly unlikely to have an attractive female heroic character (who may join the crew) a blatant killer. You think she'll cave his head in? Or just beat him so badly that he's semi-ambiguously dead? Swordsmen in one piece have the privilege or killing opponents in one hit, and we've seen Oda have dragons killed this way like, three separate times? Two of which were Zoro and the other was whom Zoro is so often paralleled to.
The "before fighting Yamato" is a cherry picked panel which is probably an inconsistency. Kaidou did not wipe himself clean before transforming within seconds of Yamato picking a fight with him.
Kaidou after fighting Luffy:
Kaidou while hitting Kinemon:
Kaidou while Yamato herself picks a fight with him:
Kaidou was already bruised and bleeding from fighting the Rooftop 5 and then Luffy
Alright I'll admit that I myself did not create the image I posted, and I'll concede that it was cherrypicked
But my point still remains that
1. It would make far more sense thematically for Yamato and/or Momo to kill Kaido because they are the characters who embody the core themes of the arc
2. Yamato has AdCoC so it would make sense for her to kill Kaido
3. Regardless of whatever powerscaling stuff you want to argue about, Oda has made it very clear that he does not care about consistent powerscaling nearly as much as fans do.
4. Zoro has no connection to Kaido while Yamato and Momo do.
Look I don't really care about headcanon powerlevels here. My point is it makes more sense for Yamato or Momo to kill Kaido than it does Zoro.
But regardless, if you compare Kaido to before he fought Yamato to after, he clearly took a lot of damage from her. And it wasn't until after he fought Yamato that people remarked he was getting weaker.
What are you basing this off of other than headcanon?
Everything I said is facts. You are the only one pushing headcannon.
You think a few small bruises mean anything. He has receive cuts and bruises throughout the rooftop battle. He can heal and recover.
Kaido face before Yamato.
Kaido's face after Yamato last attack.
Zoro was the first one to make Kaido start huffing and body shake. Zoro was the first one to cause Kaido serious damage. Kaido state after Yamato battle was a combination of all of the damage he has take and energy used.
It makes no sense for Yamato or Momo to kill Kaido. Zoro has a huge connection to Wano and Ryuma.
Zoro has better ACoC than Yamato because he can use it freely with any sword or style. He can use ACoC at a higher level, dragon sword style. With that style his ACoC is so powerful his lightning trail is so long it looks like a dragon. Yamato has not showed ACoC at that skill or strength. She just used it with one technique.
We saw how Momo affects the country of Wano (remember Udon) even whilst being a child, he's going through steps to growing up and into the position he needs to be in. If you think he's too young to be the Shogun what makes you think he can kill somebody?
Lmao what the hell are you on about? Sanji wasn't in the story in Syrup village, Usopp was and he had a hand in both causing the conflict (hearing of Kuro's plan) and his relationship to kaya stopped Kuro's plan from working.
Then with the Baratie arc Sanji's feeding Gin was a huge incitement of plot, not to mention his backstory given had huge relevance to that. Not everything's about the strength to beat the main antagonist so my argument stands I'm afraid.
Feels like a bit of a stretch, but Brook didn't really cause any of the conflict in Thriller Bark. And while he did tell the crew about the salt, that wasn't what resolved the main conflict in the end.
Neither have the narrative claim to kill Kaido, being his daughter is hardly reason to kill him. Even looking outside the story, Oda is incredibly unlikely to have an attractive female heroic character (who may join the crew) a blatant killer.
Robin was literally an assassin. And Vivi, a character widely considered to be an honorary Strawhat, worked undercover as a bounty hunter for two years
Everything I said is facts. You are the only one pushing headcannon.
You think a few small bruises mean anything. He has receive cuts and bruises throughout the rooftop battle. He can heal and recover.
Kaido face before Yamato.
Kaido's face after Yamato last attack.
Zoro was the first one to make Kaido start huffing and body shake. Zoro was the first one to cause Kaido serious damage. Kaido state after Yamato battle was a combination of all of the damage he has take and energy used.
It makes no sense for Yamato or Momo to kill Kaido. Zoro has a huge connection to Wano and Ryuma.
Zoro has better ACoC than Yamato because he can use it freely with any sword or style. He can use ACoC at a higher level, dragon sword style. With that style his ACoC is so powerful his lightning trail is so long it looks like a dragon. Yamato has not showed ACoC at that skill or strength. She just used it with one technique.
I don't really care about the powerscaling parts of this, but Zoro has, at best, a tenuous connection to Wano. Meanwhile Yamato and Momo being connected to Oden is a key part of their characters.
Becaues he said he wanted to? Because he parallels Oden, the man who would have killed Kaido?
Saying Syrup Village was a mistake on my part. I edited that.
Feels like a bit of a stretch, but Brook didn't really cause any of the conflict in Thriller Bark. And while he did tell the crew about the salt, that wasn't what resolved the main conflict in the end.
Robin was literally an assassin. And Vivi, a character widely considered to be an honorary Strawhat, worked undercover as a bounty hunter for two years
More likely than ZKK happening? Yes.
She and Momo inherited Oden's will, after all.
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I don't really care about the powerscaling parts of this, but Zoro has, at best, a tenuous connection to Wano. Meanwhile Yamato and Momo being connected to Oden is a key part of their characters.
For the record I don't think Kaido will die, but yeah Yamato and/or Momo killing Kaido makes more sense than Zoro
You can use whatever powerscaling argument you want, but at the end of the day those two characters inherited Oden's will and Zoro didn't
Yes, Zoro just inherited Oden's sword
He is able to live up to what the sword requires of him, but at the end of the day he just inherited the sword. He never inherited Oden's will in the way that Momo and Yamato did
Yes, Zoro just inherited Oden's sword
He is able to live up to what the sword requires of him, but at the end of the day he just inherited the sword. He never inherited Oden's will in the way that Momo and Yamato did
Yamato has only ever read Oden's logbook and is fangirling him. Her entire "I am gonna become Oden!" persona stems from loneliness and wanting to have friends and be loved like Oden was, re-read her flashback if you disagree.
Meanwhile you have a character who is a swordsman like Oden, who is seemingly a long lost son of Wano - being the spitting image of a Shimotsuki Daimyo, and has inherited the sword of Oden (re-read the page I posted about how the soul in a sword makes a samurai strong and enables him to fight) and moreover went on to remind Kaidou of Oden on the Rooftop and then went on to recreate Oden's achievement by perma-scarring Kaidou. After that, he makes Enma his own by using overflowing Armament (to tame the sword) and achieved Conquerors coating, again like Oden did, in the King fight. Heck, there's even more foreshadowing that he would eventually surpass Oden by making Enma black, something Oden did not do.
The master swordsman who wields Oden's beloved blade Enma to cut an oni!
Oden's beloved sword Enma was entrusted to Zoro by Hiyori. Strangely enough, its creator was a Wano swordsmith who founded Zoro's hometown, Shimotsuki Kozaburo. Regardless of whether or not Zoro was aware of this, the 'Pirate Hunter' Zoro has come to Onigashima not to hunt pirates, but to exterminate an oni, having been entrusted with this fate from long ago. As a member of the Worst Generation who shoulder the next era, he faces two of the yonko in a ferocious battle.
Yamato has only ever read Oden's logbook and is fangirling him. Her entire "I am gonna become Oden!" persona stems from loneliness and wanting to have friends and be loved like Oden was, re-read her flashback if you disagree.
Meanwhile you have a character who is a swordsman like Oden, who is seemingly a long lost son of Wano - being the spitting image of a Shimotsuki Daimyo, and has inherited the sword of Oden (re-read the page I posted about how the soul in a sword makes a samurai strong and enables him to fight) and moreover went on to remind Kaidou of Oden on the Rooftop and then went on to recreate Oden's achievement by perma-scarring Kaidou. After that, he makes Enma his own by using overflowing Armament (to tame the sword) and achieved Conquerors coating, again like Oden did, in the King fight.
Yamato's Oden persona mainly comes from two things:
1. She emphathizes with Oden's desire for freedom before he set out to sea on Whitebeard's ship
2. She genuinely believes in his ideals.
An important part of Yamato's and Momo's characters is that they both take after Oden in two completely different ways. Yamato mainly knows Oden as the brave explorer that she read about and seeks to emulate that. Momo, on the other hand, knew Oden as the wise man who was his father. Momo seeks to live up to Oden's legacy while also being seen as his own person.
The main themes of Wano are inherited will and identity, and these themes are mainly embodied by Yamato and Momo.
Like, there's really no connection between Zoro and Kaido outside of some shallow parallels.
No he doesn't, not in the way that helps your argument anyway. His father loved adventure and resented being in Wano and leading it while Momo is the complete opposite. He isn't naturally strong or brave or adventurous. His job isn't to be Oden or a better version of Oden, Zoro and Luffy are there to do that. His job is to lead Wano and not allow future Orochis to let this happen again.
Feels like a bit of a stretch, but Brook didn't really cause any of the conflict in Thriller Bark. And while he did tell the crew about the salt, that wasn't what resolved the main conflict in the end.
I'd say it's debatable in Brook's case but his having no shadow was why he couldn't accept Luffy's invitation at first, wasn't it? My memory isn't great. Would the crew have fought against Moriah if Brook wasn't there in the first place?
Robin was literally an assassin. And Vivi, a character widely considered to be an honorary Strawhat, worked undercover as a bounty hunter for two years
Were these murders shown to us? Robin's always been on the darker side but her back breaking was always more cartoonish and I'm not sure she explicitly killed on-screen. Even Iceberg didn't die. Similar situation for Vivi plus her ideas as a murderer were ambiguous at best and put in the past rather than the present, similar to most character deaths/brutal situations.
If she and Momo inherited Oden's will then so did most of the alliance. Momo didn't even take up Oden's blade while Enma, the one given all the attention was taken up by Zoro, who scarred Kaido like Oden. If you don't believe Zoro inherited Oden's will by receiving Enma, what about Hiyori, she most likely inherited Oden's will, no? Or Yasuie and the people of Ebisu?
Like Oden said, Kaido is the real enemy. We've seen Zoro throughout act 1 and 2 building relationships, some coming to huge climaxes and endings, yet you believe Yamato who came about in act 3 and has no reason other than she doesn't like Kaido and wants to be Oden will do it? If all she wants is to be like Oden then she should step aside and let the next generation fix her mistakes.
That's what Oda has been doing the last couple of decades, using a samurai to decapitate a dragon.
If you read the who in my opening post, you would know that.
No he doesn't, not in the way that helps your argument anyway. His father loved adventure and resented being in Wano and leading it while Momo is the complete opposite. He isn't naturally strong or brave or adventurous. His job isn't to be Oden or a better version of Oden, Zoro and Luffy are there to do that. His job is to lead Wano and not allow future Orochis to let this happen again.
I'd say it's debatable in Brook's case but his having no shadow was why he couldn't accept Luffy's invitation at first, wasn't it? My memory isn't great. Would the crew have fought against Moriah if Brook wasn't there in the first place?
The crew fought against Moria because they wandered into his territory and he stole their shadows. They wanted to help Brook as well, but he's not the reason they got roped into the conflict
Were these murders shown to us? Robin's always been on the darker side but her back breaking was always more cartoonish and I'm not sure she explicitly killed on-screen. Even Iceberg didn't die. Similar situation for Vivi plus her ideas as a murderer were ambiguous at best and put in the past rather than the present, similar to most character deaths/brutal situations.
Have we seen any Strawhat kill anyone on screen? We know that Zoro was a bounty hunter who killed pirates because he got lost and needed to avoid starving, but we never actually see him do it.
Robin's in a similar boat as Zoro. We don't see her kill anyone, but it's explicitly confirmed that, yes, she has killed before
And as for Vivi, while they never SAY she killed anyone, she was one of the high-ranking members in a bounty hunter organization.
And also for what it's worth, there was a filler scene where Nami straight up murdered a guy
If she and Momo inherited Oden's will then so did most of the alliance. Momo didn't even take up Oden's blade while Enma, the one given all the attention was taken up by Zoro, who scarred Kaido like Oden. If you don't believe Zoro inherited Oden's will by receiving Enma, what about Hiyori, she most likely inherited Oden's will, no? Or Yasuie and the people of Ebisu?
You cannot compare the way Yamato and Momo inherited Oden's will to how the other samurai did. In Yamato's and Momo's case, them inheriting Oden's will tied into their identity as people. Their entire lives were built around how they chose to carry Oden's legacy. One of Wano's main themes is identity, and it's arguably best exemplified by Momo and Yamato
By comparison, Zoro's connection with Oden is pretty shallow. He got his sword and that's about it. While it is true that Zoro was given a lot of focus in Act 1 and 2, in Onigashima he's gotten significantly less focus than Momo and Yamato have. There's a reason they're the ones watching Luffy defeat Kaido, after all
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