Questions & Mysteries Why did Luffy's fruit become relevant years after he became a famous pirate?

TheAncientCenturion

I will never forgive Oda
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#41
I don’t know, perhaps Shanks went to them after stealing it and used it as leverage? You said we can tinfoil here, so I’m guessing that the red hair came to disagree with Roger’s vision of the future because he didn’t see what the rest of the crew did at Laugh Tale, but he learned enough of the details once they returned to fuck the whole plan up; he pinpointed the Gomu Gomu no Mi so he could make sure nobody ate it, telling the Gorosei that he would protect it even before he became one of the four most powerful pirates in the world; once Luffy ate it, both Shanks and the WG decided killing a child was in poor taste and that it was better to keep him under the former’s long-distance mentorship just in case he wanted to do something reckless like become the next Pirate King :smart:
I can definitely dig the idea of Shanks getting disillusioned with Laugh Tale if he was told how it was. Luffy said he’d be the same way. But I don’t think the WG would bat an eye at murdering a child after what we saw in Robin’s flashback.
 

HA001

World's Strongest Swordsman
#42
That makes a lot of new questions: why did no one in his crew eat it? Where was he taking it? Etc.

Were the RHP there to find Ace in fact, but missed him?
Shanks knows what it is.
He knows who ace is.
He is taking it to the east blue to give to ace and mould him into joyboy like Roger wanted

Until luffy ate it.
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I don’t think the admirals get told shit honestly. They don’t know Luffy’s fruit is special
The wg wanted it for a reason to jail who who for so long
They know luffy has it
Who's who fkin knew luffy had it from marienford reports or some shit too.
 
#43
Back then a rookie was easy to ignore regardless of the fruit.
In time skip maybe they thought the emperors will simply crush him probably.
In a sense is fair to not overcomplicate things (for the WG) cuz the Yonkos have rule several years and all new supernovas couldn't do a thing

But in another ligth....the government was really dumb if it was that important then getting the DF from the get go shouldn't have been priority.
 

Rosella.Fiamingo

Peerless In History
#44
The World Government knows about Luffy AND his ability for years. So if the scary fruit is indeed his devil fruit, why only react to it now? They said Wano was a good opportunity to "get rid of that nuisance", but why not get rid of him when he was a rookie? It could imply that they are either not very worried, or just ignorant of what might happen when it's awakened. Suddenly that turned into "eliminate Straw Hat Luffy at once".

Was it in fact Shanks who informed them of its importance? Did they know of the conditions it needed for awakening? Are the conditions a combination of death/being a D./being Luffy?

I won't ever consider Shanks not wanting the best for Luffy as a Shanks fan, but did Shanks know how important this awakening was? Could that be the reason he saved Luffy from dying, knowing the catalyst for awakening would be Luffy's death? (def not, but throwing this one in for @Paperchampion23 and his shady Shanks theory)


A lot of questions I want answered after this chapter :hurry: curious about some opinions @Akai2 @TheAncientCenturion @Jew D. Boy @djiayebee @Garp the Fist @Bogard @RayanOO @Marimo_420 @Tyki_Mikk @Sentinel @Seraphoenix @Nidai_Kitetsu @Kejon @Fujishiro @Rosella.Fiamingo etcccc


EDIT: also, not being awakened in centuries, do you think the awakening conditions weren't met before? Or that no one had the fruit?
Oda is a Hack and all of this was not planned. Even if the Gorosei dont know, IMU should know yet let Luffy rise in power. It's just Hack writing. Looking at all of this logically, it makes no sense they didn't do anything until now.
 
#45
Because he's already lost 4 times and Oda saw no way for his Lubricant boy to win against Kaido. 4 losses 0 consequences, so something had to give. Couldn't be G5 cause, he ain't mastered G5 time limit yet. Hence joyboy hiding in a fruit and haki stuff. #KishimotoCool-Aid
 
#46
A few thoughts.

-people always make the assumption that the Gorosei basically know everything in the world. From their scenes with Shanks and the one where Zunisha appeared, I don’t think that is actually the case. They seemed to think it was impossible for the fruit to awaken- if it hasn’t happened in 800 years, they have good reason tbh.

-There’s something special about the combination of Luffy, Momo, this moment in history and the land of Wano itself. It seems to be this that’s unlocking the Awakening, not just a hard battle. The Roger Pirates spoke of a special time, the Sea Kings have been waiting for it, Toki sent Momo twenty years in the future for a reason. And Sengoku, Kaido and Big Mom have all said there’s something special about Wano, that a part of One Piece is there. This is all presumably tying into the borders being shut and getting ready to open.

-Shanks? Still whole-heartedly believe that he is a good person and has Luffy’s best interests at heart- and thinks that Luffy is the only one who can change the world.

Oda needs to stick the landing for this more than anything he’s done in years. Maybe the entire series.
 
#48
-people always make the assumption that the Gorosei basically know everything in the world. From their scenes with Shanks and the one where Zunisha appeared, I don’t think that is actually the case. They seemed to think it was impossible for the fruit to awaken- if it hasn’t happened in 800 years, they have good reason tbh.
I agree that they don't know everything. They 100% wouldn't have told CP-0 to eliminate Luffy had they known it was going to trigger this.
 

TheAncientCenturion

I will never forgive Oda
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#50
Oh yeah, and there’s the whole thing where King, with presumably some ancient Lunarian legend, initially believed that Kaido was Joy Boy. Or could become Joy Boy? So why did he believe that when Kaido, as far as we know is not a D, and we certainly know he doesn’t have Luffy‘s fruit?
I think Joyboy is some inherited will type thing or Poseidon like prophecy. So maybe the Lunarian said another Joyboy will come about and change the world and it’s coincidence that Luffy is Joyboy and has this special fruit
 
#51
It's tinfoil but WG may have someone that can predict the future/pinpoint the next big threat aka Im Sama.

Let's rewind to Wano itself, Roger and Oden knew the exact timings of JoyBoy return. They knew someone will arive in 20 years that will free Wano in future. The future aspects of One piece is not limited to just few seconds like Katakuri,, there's more to it.

There's countless possibilities. Maybe Shanks actually snitched about Luffy,, maybe he believe Luffy is now ready and must take on the WG. Anyhow Oda showed us Im Sama with the big Hat and few targets that needs to be erased. With DF, everything is possible in One piece even moving into the future. Whatever his reasons were he had Luffy as one of the picks. This happened recently in the story not 2 years back or in East Blue.

Giving Oda the benefit of doubt here,, wG might not actually be aware of this threat or DF few arcs back. They changed the name of the DF for anyone to connect it to Joy boy and when you honestly think about it 800 years is very very big duration,, long enough for WG and Nav6 attention to shift to other aspects,, like The Pirate Era Roger started or matters concerning the 20 Kingdoms and Yonkou.​
 

Dickie D. Dick

SII - Sakazuki Incinerate Imu
#52
Nice fanfic.
The Gorosei always sent people after Fluffy.
At the start Smoker and Hina were on their case - Smoker let them leave and Hina forces were destroyed by Ace
Than Kuzan meet them at LRLI and said he went there to check on the new crew that Nico Robin joined, do you think the Gorosei don't know where their Admirals going? They probably assumed Kuzan going to capture Fluffy but he LARP as usual
CP9 made deal to let Fluffy and co to leave because only because they have intel to get Pluton and that's more important, Spandam also worked with Kuzan behind the scenes.
Than Sengoku sent Garp who let them runaway *again*
Than they sent Kuma to aid Gecko Moria but Kuma let them leave
Than they sent Kizaru and Kuma and the new PX units yet Rayleigh and Kuma saved them
Than they send Admiral Fujitora and retired Sengoku and Tsuru and bunch of other Vice Admirals - and what's happened? Fujitora let them go again

The idea that the Gorosei never went after Fluffy is false they also sent some of their strongest people after him it's just that Fluffy wasn't important enough back than to send more and that their own people betray them. :kayneshrug:

As for the recent attention about the awakening? False hype.
 
#54
Nice fanfic.
The Gorosei always sent people after Fluffy.
At the start Smoker and Hina were on their case - Smoker let them leave and Hina forces were destroyed by Ace
Than Kuzan meet them at LRLI and said he went there to check on the new crew that Nico Robin joined, do you think the Gorosei don't know where their Admirals going? They probably assumed Kuzan going to capture Fluffy but he LARP as usual
CP9 made deal to let Fluffy and co to leave because only because they have intel to get Pluton and that's more important, Spandam also worked with Kuzan behind the scenes.
Than Sengoku sent Garp who let them runaway *again*
Than they sent Kuma to aid Gecko Moria but Kuma let them leave
Than they sent Kizaru and Kuma and the new PX units yet Rayleigh and Kuma saved them
Than they send Admiral Fujitora and retired Sengoku and Tsuru and bunch of other Vice Admirals - and what's happened? Fujitora let them go again

The idea that the Gorosei never went after Fluffy is false they also sent some of their strongest people after him it's just that Fluffy wasn't important enough back than to send more and that their own people betray them. :kayneshrug:

As for the recent attention about the awakening? False hype.
Tldr; you're basically just saying that the WG are completely incompetent.

Because Oda lied about planning out OP from the start. Beautiful and profound moments at the start of the series like roger's speech or shanks passing on the hat just feel so hollow after the joy boy revelation. There's just no way they belong in the same series.
Not really, we aren't sure what Joy Boy is. Maybe that IS the DF awakening.
 
#56
Giving Oda the benefit of doubt here,, wG might not actually be aware of this threat or DF few arcs back. They changed the name of the DF for anyone to connect it to Joy boy and when you honestly think about it 800 years is very very big duration,, long enough for WG and Nav6 attention to shift to other aspects,, like The Pirate Era Roger started or matters concerning the 20 Kingdoms and Yonkou.
I was thinking that but they must have known there was something special about the Gomu Gomu from at least fifteen odd years ago cause otherwise WW wouldn‘t have been guarding it and been chucked in prison for losing it.
 

Bogard

You can't win
#57
In my opinion, the gorosei believed Ace was Joyboy(which could still have been the case Tbh with the whole "inherited will"). He was a D, the son of the previous pirate king, with many people including Roger or Whitebeard believing he'd become the next pirate king, wanting to groom him to become one

That's why they prioritized having an all out war to kill him when they had the opportunity

So in a sense, Ace's threat lvl covered Luffy's, and for this reason, although they also believed Luffy was a threat due to being a D, the focus on Ace made Luffy's threat lvl secondarily to Ace's in the government's eyes

Also another thing that always caught my attention, when they talked about the "great cleansing" is they said they'd have to do it "another time", with the first one imo being in relation to Ace's death in MF, with Luffy's threat lvl to them growing over the timeskip
 
#58
I wanted to make a post on this but I think you've already nailed the question so I'll just add my thoughts here.

Imo, I think it's become clear now that Shanks was at least talking to the Gorosei about Luffy and not another pirate. When you "thematically" place scenes from before and during Wano, the purpose of that scene seems to have been used to drive what we see in 1037. We unironically do not see the Gorosei again after chapter 908, discussing a different topic (Cobra), not until 1037 at least.


I'm gonna walk through my thought process here:

- Post timeskip, Shanks is not seen for literally 300+ chapters outside of a cover story (celebrating a Luffy bounty raise no less lol). He's never shown in real time since Marineford.

- In chapter 903, the first time we see Shanks post-timeskip in chapter content, hes looking VERY competitively at Luffy's 1.5 Billion bounty poster.

- In chapter 907, we see Shanks talking to the Gorosei. Thing about the timing of this conversation. It only happens AFTER he sees Luffy's poster.

- Oda does a very weird literally technique (imo, not a good one) where he'll have a character randomly talk about a topic unrelated to them, without a lack of foresight. There see multiple examples of this, but there are 2 in Onigashima's battle. One is when the CP-0 member randomly brings up the idea of Vegapunk's artificial DF being missing from PH and "shivering" at the idea that a second dragon could exist. This literally was a forced foreshadow on Momo growing big and making a big entrance, however it was "unknown" to the reader at the time that Oda would do this unless theorized. The 2nd one, imo, was Who's Who talking about Luffy, Shanks, the Gum Gum fruit and Sun God Nika. WsW is the ONLY Beast Pirate Member who is a former WG employee. Coincidentally, he's the only fight where exposition is delivered that is unrrelated to their fight. King remembers Kaido wanting to be Joyboy and rescuing him, but it ties to Zoro and him both believing in their captains. WsW here literally talks about how he bears a grudge on Shanks for stealing the fruit, which has literally nothing to do with anything. Even Sun God Nika is a weird lore dump. Yes, it's tied to him mouthing off about slavery, which pisses Jinbe off, but the ACTUAL topic is very random....unless it's not (i.e. recent events).

- In 1037, the Gorosei talk about some hidden devil fruit with a different name. Context, once again like the above, is seemingly forced because the reader has NO idea what this is supposed to mean, not until its elaborated on. The biggest piece of news here is that they clearly did not know this beforehand (or at least did not know there was a connection between what they know and Luffy/Zunisha), they even ask why the WG hid the name. This is a question they also want answered. Hence, someone fed this info to them recently and they are still deliberating on it.

- 1041 then confirms that the goal that Rob Lucci relayed to them 13-14 chapters prior (capture/kill Robin) is being overshadowed by the Gorosei wanting Luffy dead. This is an IMMEDIATE change based on Zunisha arriving.

- Dialogue between the CP-0 members here implies that they are killing him as a preventative measure, "its all rumors and heresay". I.e., this means the Gorosei were told something that they did not truly "believe" until the Elephant arrived at Wano.

- The Gorosei have uttered not a word about Luffy and his powers. Not in 1000 chapters of One Piece. Sure, his annoyance as a D. Clan member, but nothing on the level of "HE MUST DIE NOW". Again, shows that there's been a major goal shift the moment Zunisha showed up.

- Finally 1043 confirms that whatever fruit they were talking about, whatever awakening it might be, is hidden under the guise of the Gum Gum fruit, effectively tying all of this together.


So essentially, it seems Shanks stole the fruit, knowing it's purpose. Found out about Luffy (or Ace? @HA001 made a good point the other day that maybe Luffy was never part of the plan, but Ace was) at Fushia. There Luffy, the idiot, destined himself into eating that fruit.

By this point Shanks rolled with it and became friends with Luffy, making sure he survived as a kid and "gambling" his arm on watching him grow, with the intended goal of him becoming an exemplary pirate to save the world because its his "destiny"......right??????

However there are now two things that seemingly contradict this.

1. Shanks never went to Laugh Tale. In Roger's flashback, it was made excruciatingly clear that he and Buggy do not know where it is and will go on their own. Oden sees Roger tell Shanks something, but does not hear it. Imo, it was not about said prophecy and Laugh Tale, but something related to Shanks and his motivations. If it was about the former, i think Oda would have made it clear (just like I believe that if Shanks were talking about Blackbeard, Oda would have made it obvious instead of just saying "a certain pirate".

2. Shanks even telling the Gorosei something (i.e. warning them/letting them know facts about Luffy or what he did) is extremely red flaggish. The fact that he can just go there to speak with them is already weird in of it self. It shows he's not really against them (at least not outwardly like Luffy would be). If he wanted Luffy to directly succeed with no issues, why tell them anything? Why feed the enemy information like this? Sure, it could be to service Joyboy's return, but again, Shanks should not know about most of Laugh Tale.

In my opinion, Shanks is a 3rd party with separate motives, working on neither side to service his own direct goals. He wanted Luffy (or Ace?) to become Joyboy and fight the WG, but he is purposefully setting them on a collision course before Luffy even becomes PK. Why, if destiny is meant to be fulfilled, would he need to influence the WG into doing this? Why not let "destiny" resolve itself anyway.

So the main questions (to me) are:

- How did Shanks come upon this information?
- WHY is Shanks doing this in the first place?



What does Shanks gain out of this? Surely, we will find out soon, as Oda has been hyping up his character recently, especially with the film being made. I'm sure he cares about Luffy. I'm sure he's not "EVIL". But something is definitely up with him, and not in a good way

@Tyki_Mikk @Bounty @Sentinel
 
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#59
The Gorosei seem to be the main informants and give orders to the world government and marines.

The issue was they were unaware about Luffys fruit until just recently. It’s likely that Imu changed the name of the fruit himself and since Luffys name is Straw Hat and not like “Rubber Man” he wouldn’t know Luffy was the current possessor of the Gum Gum fruit until recently. Whether that was because Imu began taking notice after Marineford, or because shanks told them is still to be unseen.
 
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