Powers & Abilities Why the black blade puts Mihawk and Ryuma above Oden by default
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There is something that sword fanboys can't understand : Even if you'r a swordman, your whole value as a fighter is not always to be reduced as a mere swordman that only can use his sword with at best armament haki in it.
This is because it's more than likely that never zoro will learn top tier COA nor COC, same goes for Mihawk that they put all their hope in the idea that your swordmanship is everything once you use a sword as a main weapon.
But this is just not the case.
This is because it's more than likely that never zoro will learn top tier COA nor COC, same goes for Mihawk that they put all their hope in the idea that your swordmanship is everything once you use a sword as a main weapon.
But this is just not the case.
Hitetsu sees that Zoro’s potential is higher than Oden’s - that it’s more on the level of their God, Ryuma.
It’s funny that you took Hitetsu realizing Zoro has amazing potential to mean that black blades are common. We’ve seen less black blades than we have CoC users. And the two black blade users have been WSM (Ryuma) or WSS (Mihawk)
It’s funny that you took Hitetsu realizing Zoro has amazing potential to mean that black blades are common. We’ve seen less black blades than we have CoC users. And the two black blade users have been WSM (Ryuma) or WSS (Mihawk)
First of all, to understand my point, I think that there are, at least, 2 kind of CoA.
For all we know now the only ability that is more rare than the ability to turn a blade permanently black is future sight. And FS was present to be the acme of a kind of CoO. Therefore it is not far fetched to think that turning a blade permanently black is the acme of a kind of CoA.
This kind of CoA seems to be the one that the swordsmen need to work on to attained the acme of swordsmanship. So it is totally logical that the « Sword God » and the « World’s strongest swordsman » mastered this kind of CoA. It is clearly a proof of strength and of mastery Haki wise.
Why Shanks, Oden, Roger, Whitebeard and others Top tier blade users did not show to have black blade?
Because they are/were not as pro efficient in this kind of CoA than Mihawk and Ryuma. The same way that Katakuri is more proefficient in a kind of CoO than Big Mom, Rayleigh and Kaido for example.
Roger and WB seems to be more proefficient in the barrier kind of CoA.
Now, is having a black blade is proof enough that X is stronger than Y?
No. This is why to prove that Zoro is above Oden, he will re-open Kaido’s wound AND turned Enma black.
He will show that he is stronger or as strong as Oden physically and stronger than him CoA wise.
And the fact that Zoro is weaker than Mihawk means that Prime Oden is weaker than Mihawk.
For all we know now the only ability that is more rare than the ability to turn a blade permanently black is future sight. And FS was present to be the acme of a kind of CoO. Therefore it is not far fetched to think that turning a blade permanently black is the acme of a kind of CoA.
This kind of CoA seems to be the one that the swordsmen need to work on to attained the acme of swordsmanship. So it is totally logical that the « Sword God » and the « World’s strongest swordsman » mastered this kind of CoA. It is clearly a proof of strength and of mastery Haki wise.
Why Shanks, Oden, Roger, Whitebeard and others Top tier blade users did not show to have black blade?
Because they are/were not as pro efficient in this kind of CoA than Mihawk and Ryuma. The same way that Katakuri is more proefficient in a kind of CoO than Big Mom, Rayleigh and Kaido for example.
Roger and WB seems to be more proefficient in the barrier kind of CoA.
Now, is having a black blade is proof enough that X is stronger than Y?
No. This is why to prove that Zoro is above Oden, he will re-open Kaido’s wound AND turned Enma black.
He will show that he is stronger or as strong as Oden physically and stronger than him CoA wise.
And the fact that Zoro is weaker than Mihawk means that Prime Oden is weaker than Mihawk.
To be above Oden he has to at the very least kill by his own Kaido - without external help, and in inferiority in numbers as was Oden who was going for the kill and was tricked before it to happen. He won't have this amount of power till EOS.
Mihawk couldn't do it ever either.
Oden was top 5 in the verse in his prime, with Roger, WB, Garp mostly.
Mihawk couldn't do it ever either.
Oden was top 5 in the verse in his prime, with Roger, WB, Garp mostly.
This is fine, the narrative of the arc shows that Zoro won't be above Oden in wano, nor will luffy - because if luffy beats Kaido it won't be in a 1v1, with only 9 men vs 5k. People do understimate too much Oden while Oda wanks him everytime he can. Mihawk is below him factually, a black sword doesn't prove anything in the Oden's case - nor does it in Shanks, Roger or Wb case -, and i agree on you in this.
if he is, he has to kill by himself without external help, Kaido. I will even forget the 9 vs 5k men + snitch disadvantage that had Oden and still was going for the kill without the trick.
If he does, i would consider him stronger than Oden, that's it.
that's fine, so everyone can fight Meme, if Zoro will surpass Oden in this arc, he can focus alone on Kaido while everyone else will take care of BM so nobody will disturb his fight, and has to kill him. If he doesn't alone, he won't surpass Oden in this arc.
And i guess you know that Mihawk either can't do that in the current verse.
If he does, i would consider him stronger than Oden, that's it.
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that's fine, so everyone can fight Meme, if Zoro will surpass Oden in this arc, he can focus alone on Kaido while everyone else will take care of BM so nobody will disturb his fight, and has to kill him. If he doesn't alone, he won't surpass Oden in this arc.
And i guess you know that Mihawk either can't do that in the current verse.
How do you know he couldn't? All the flashback was about praising Oden, and even when he fought Kaido, kaido has to rely on 5k men, a snitch among the few men of Oden, and a trick. And before the trick, the narrator - Oda - was saying how much despite all the preparation, Oden was incredible and did better than all expectations. During what we saw from the fight, Kaido was just getting soloed like an abused dog - not any single panel where it was even an equal fight - so much that his allies were afraid of him to lose, and had to create a trick for him to win. It's a clear sign for those who understand Oda's pattern, that when you win like that despite beeing humiliated all along, with a trick, it means you can't win with proper methods. What conclusion do you take from this?
This is exactly the natural conclusion to get from Oda's narrative.If Kaido was stronger, he wouldn't need 5k men to beat 9 men - with a snitch in it -, to know where and when Oden will attack to prepare for it the best way possible - the complete opposite of this current raid -, wouldn't be seen as an abused dog in ALL panels that Oda showed us from the fight - not even a stalling, he was just humiliated all around - AND need a trick to not definitively lose.
The funniest part is to believe current Zoro or even Mihawk can duplicate the feat of Oden. The sole way to consider this black blade cope seriously is to show us in a 1v1 fight between Zoro or Mihawk vs Kaido that they will kill him without external help.
This won't happen until EOS for zoro at best. And will never happen for Mihawk.
I find funny that people use this "age" argument as a way to cope : If Kaido was weaker back then, so was Oden, they weren't that much different age wise, if Kaido became stronger with time, so could've done Oden if Oda wanted to keep him in the script. And the power scale difference, would remain the same, ie Oden having the edge.
The funniest part is to believe current Zoro or even Mihawk can duplicate the feat of Oden. The sole way to consider this black blade cope seriously is to show us in a 1v1 fight between Zoro or Mihawk vs Kaido that they will kill him without external help.
This won't happen until EOS for zoro at best. And will never happen for Mihawk.
I find funny that people use this "age" argument as a way to cope : If Kaido was weaker back then, so was Oden, they weren't that much different age wise, if Kaido became stronger with time, so could've done Oden if Oda wanted to keep him in the script. And the power scale difference, would remain the same, ie Oden having the edge.
What the fuck has Zoro done for Kitesu to think he has potential that only Ryuuma their sword god had? Makes far more sense that black blades are common. Especially given we read Ryuuma awakened it after a lot of battles. Not because he had some super Ryou
If many battles was all it took then oden who had enma for 30 plus years and was ALWAYS fighting definitely would have turned it black.
Case in point being zoro will likely leave wano with the nidai kitetsu thats been sat on tengus wall for god knows how long and will also make that kokuto by eos with in op ti.e is not that long a time. So no volume of fights is not THE reason for it.
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It was 1000 iirc