Chapter Discussion ONE PIECE 974: ONWARD TO ONIGASHIMA

[OEKaneki]

I'm not wanting some horror "Orochi was the coolest guy" stuff.

Just an acknowledgement by the Kozuki's that yeah, they played a big part in causing Orochi and Kanjuro to be the way they were. Although I suppose maybe the atonement dance from Oden counts for that, I dunno.

I mean, who’s really alive that would understand that? All of that stuff happened well before Momonosuke and Hiyori, and I doubt anybody would have explained it to them. Maybe Hiyori, I guess. But other than them, there’s no Kozuki left.

 

[Godusopp]

Well, since we know he can do good drawings, maybe he'll make a good bird to fly to Onigashima or something?



I've seen someone say that he's based off of a "Kuroko" in Kabuki theater - they were people dressed all in black who were basically stage hands. They moved props and costumes and such and were basically wearing black to give the impression that they weren't really there.



I like the theory that the Kurozumi family usurping the throne was originally backed by the WG to keep Wano closed off from the world. That way they have a monopoly on seastone and a historical enemy is effectively neutralized.

The bird and cat he drew earlier were barely able to carry him. This a whole sea with unpredictable weather and a nasty storm raging.

 

[Herasux]

Reading the entirety of the Spoiler Discussion thread to the actual Chapter Discussion thread was wild af, but I've finally made it. For me, the chapter was a 5/5, and while it was disappointing to read Kanjuro receiving so much negative feedback because of his role, I personally still like him as a character and feel even more intrigued by him now that we have learned even more about him.

It's very interesting that Orochi decided that Kanjuro would play the role OF a "Kurozomi" which seems to imply that he isn't one at all actually, but it is possible that a Kurozomi couple took him in as though he was one of their own. I'm excited to read the chapter on VIZ so it cant come soon enough for me. Also, if that does mean that Kanjuro is not an actual Kurozumi, just playing one, I really would like to know what Kanjuro, is, actually. An ink child/monster?

Also, as a "Kurozumi" I definitely think Kanjuro deserves a chance to make things right or atleast be able to find his emotions again, some sense of self outside of having been so lost for so long. It just seems so tragic.

Luffy/Law/Kid coming in and pretty much getting the Scabbards out of bind after they tried doing stuff on their own - just heading out on faith, I guess - was pretty cool. I'm not sure how the plan is going to go at Onigashima, but if Big Mom is there and enters the fray, I just don't believe they are mighty enough to fight them both - better chances just fighting one of them obviously. We just won't know until we know.

...And while it was smart of Orochi to see an opportunity in Kanjuro when he was a child/young blob, I also greatly dislike him even more for taking advantage of him when he was in such a destroyed state of mind. With his "parents" gone, all he had left was theater to cling to and in that state, I suppose it was all too easy to simply stand to the call as an actor. Just sad man.

 

[Cyrus the Cactus]

The bird and cat he drew earlier were barely able to carry him. This a whole sea with unpredictable weather and a nasty storm raging.

He can draw a clone that fools the other scabbards - a functioning animal shouldn't be too tall an order for him. It's the only way he can really get back to Onigashima, assuming the "Kanjuro as the traitor" plot isn't gonna be wrapped up just yet. I guess him going to the Flower Capital would work too. That way Denjiro can reveal himself to Kin and Kan.

 

[Homelander]

First half of the chapter was a decent enough translation, but stilted. Don't have a clue about the second half though. Whose the "messy one?" Is it Luffy that's jabbering about the "me" that ate? What does that even mean?

Anyway, Kanjuro's the one I thought had the best chances of being the traitor, so glad that paid out. Good to see that, yeah, he's totally nuts and all, but like Orochi, he's got good reason for being the way he is. Commit genocide against an entire family for the sins of the father and it's no wonder they tend not to respond well. Think Oda's going to have to give one of the two some forgiveness at the end of the arc, and acknowledge that they were done wrong.

Also it'll be fun to go back and look at what Kanjuro's done in the past with this knowledge. Big one that stands out for me is when he randomly covered Kine'mon's eyes so they got hit by the wee monkey mink and got stopped from going to Zou. Curious to see what he'll be capable of fighting wise.

Also, has he been ugly Shinobu the whole time? Does that explain her randomly screaming when Nami was in the rafters with her? Is hot Shinobu somewhere else?

Have to say, though, not sure why we needed to have that weird bit with him apparently wanting to die with Oden. Why not just have him use one of his art clones? Seems a bit unnecessary, though probably set up for the eventual, if not redemption, but forgiveness, for Kanjuro. Acknowledgement that the guys been so fucked up that he'd willingly die, unlike Orochi whose a cowardly little rat in every respects.

The Kurozumi's giving Kanjuro the specific fruit he needed also reinforces me being very curious as to why Orochi was given his fruit. It surely must have a use

Great scene with them busting out the sea though. Sadly means that we aren't getting that Luffy free volume that I thought we would, chances are this chapter is the last one in Volume 96.

Let battle commence, I guess. I don't actually think they are going to fail, unlike most people. I'm considering this moment to be the equivalent of the Sea Train crashing into EL.

Its odd maybe he is just weird psychopath, kanjuro's character is now very interesting.

I agree with you Oda could set him up well as things progress. His loyality overall is only because of how korzumi coan were mistreated. Orochi gave him the platform to take revenge.

I am curious if kanjuro has conflicting personality, during the escape he was shown to care oden . So he never really hated them.

I ll see how it goes, but i doubt the scabbard will ever accept him or the allies will think about it.

 

[MagnetoKid]

This chapter is too overwhelming .That last panel literally sends shivers to the spine. The Boys are back!!!
Impressed Kanjuro drawing could withstand tough weather
Kid legend begins in wano. Kaido, calamities, apoo, numbers better watch out... no one is safe.
I'M SO FUCKING HYPE LETS GO!!!!!!!!!!!! The greatest war is about to begin.
This chapter perfectly illustrates why one piece is undoubtedly the best manga ever. Long live Oda-Sensei!!

 

[pedxi]

I bet Kid already off paneled Apoo
typical oda move:yasu:

 

[wordyworm]

Can anyone guess the significance of showing Kanjuro as an ink blob?

I posted this in the spoilers discussion. I think it fits pretty well!

Young Kanjuro was a stagehand!

Kuroko (Japanese: 黒子, lit. "black child") are stagehands in traditional Japanese theatre, who dress all in black.

In kabuki, the kuroko serve many of the same purposes as running crew. They move scenery and props on stage, aiding in scene changes and costume changes. They will also often play the role of animals, will-o-the-wisps, or other roles which are played not by an actor in full costume, but by holding a prop. Kuroko wear all black, head to toe, in order to imply that they are invisible and not part of the action onstage.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuroko

So Kanjuro went from being an invisible stagehand to a starring role. His costume started as a background character, but as an adult he has a full Kabuki star outfit and face paint.

 

[R A I T E I I I]

I hadn't read one piece for over 1 month or 2. I may get flamed but geez how bored i got during that flashback lol

 

[ImmaIvanoM]

I hadn't read one piece for over 1 month or 2. I may get flamed but geez how bored i got during that flashback lol

The flashback was boring. But now we're done with it and War is upon us

 

[Nvax]

There's really like 10 pages of Zoro fanboys damage controlling why he wasnt in the big three supernova spread.

 

[K!NG HARA$H!MA]

I bet Kid already off paneled Apoo
typical oda move:yasu:

Apoo is way too strong for that

 

[DarkWitch]

What if during the battle against Kanjuro he draws Oden.

 

[Worst]

 

[Berserker]

When on the sea, do as the pirates do.

 

[Bil02]

So since kanjuro is holding momonosuke hostage on tokage harbor,are the auction trio alliance+ scabbards going to move backwards to save him? Or are the remaining samurais eustass kid talked about going to save momonosuke on their way to onigashima?
Anyways excellent chapter and happy we are back in the present.
Hopefully the war starts by next month.

 

[Flower]

Reading the entirety of the Spoiler Discussion thread to the actual Chapter Discussion thread was wild af, but I've finally made it. For me, the chapter was a 5/5, and while it was disappointing to read Kanjuro receiving so much negative feedback because of his role, I personally still like him as a character and feel even more intrigued by him now that we have learned even more about him.

It's very interesting that Orochi decided that Kanjuro would play the role OF a "Kurozomi" which seems to imply that he isn't one at all actually, but it is possible that a Kurozomi couple took him in as though he was one of their own. I'm excited to read the chapter on VIZ so it cant come soon enough for me. Also, if that does mean that Kanjuro is not an actual Kurozumi, just playing one, I really would like to know what Kanjuro, is, actually. An ink child/monster?

Also, as a "Kurozumi" I definitely think Kanjuro deserves a chance to make things right or atleast be able to find his emotions again, some sense of self outside of having been so lost for so long. It just seems so tragic.

Luffy/Law/Kid coming in and pretty much getting the Scabbards out of bind after they tried doing stuff on their own - just heading out on faith, I guess - was pretty cool. I'm not sure how the plan is going to go at Onigashima, but if Big Mom is there and enters the fray, I just don't believe they are mighty enough to fight them both - better chances just fighting one of them obviously. We just won't know until we know.

...And while it was smart of Orochi to see an opportunity in Kanjuro when he was a child/young blob, I also greatly dislike him even more for taking advantage of him when he was in such a destroyed state of mind. With his "parents" gone, all he had left was theater to cling to and in that state, I suppose it was all too easy to simply stand to the call as an actor. Just sad man.

Tbh I think they will make up. His story seems like the perfect opportunity for a redemption story. We had stuff like that before with Pudding and Viola to some extent. People that are actually nice, but were used by other people.

 

[Flower]

What a banger of a chapter to return to the present with. The art is simply gorgeous with all the ships, the stormy atmosphere, and all those chaotic Wano waves. Perfect weather to pull a traitor move lol.

It looks we finally get an answer to Kaido's motivation for hunting down the time jumping Scabbards. Orochi is reasonably paranoid that his spy reappeared after 20 years with a written note, he's not going to believe the full story unless he sees him in the flesh. Kanjuro was not aware he needed to present more conclusive evidence to his overly suspicious boss Orochi, but they still take a gamble on his info. Rather than the secrets of the world, Kaido is more about how the hell they jumped through time and is interested in meeting a Kozuki for the first time in decades. To be fair, the possibility of a time travel Devil Fruit could very well unravel the secrets of the world in Kaido's eyes. But what exactly do Kaido and Orochi want with Momonosuke? Even Doflamingo was out to capture rather than kill him. Kaido had some praise for the Kozuki history at the time of Oden's death and I wonder if thru Momo we'll find out why.

Very satisfying to finally see traitor Kanjuro enter the stage. I was worried in the flashback Oda might end up creating a new character as the traitor just to subvert expectations. The twist with Kanjuro has had hundreds of chapters of build up, he was the second Scabbard introduced after the leader Kin'emon. There was little hints dropped here and there like the usefulness of his painting DF, the Vivre Card needed for Zou, but the holes were so wide open you could substitute most of the other Scabbards who had not fully revealed their abilities. The strongest claim came from hististorical lore surrounding the traitorous painter Yamada Emosaku. The flashback seriously put this to the test as the retainers showed a lot of love and loyalty to Oden and he repaid them by giving up his own life for theirs and entrusting them with his dream. For a Scabbard to be a traitor, they would have to be an utter psychopath. That's just what we get the moment Kanjuro chooses to reveal himself in a dramatic, theatrical, completely unecessary manner.

Kanjuro's backstory adds a very unique layer I've never seen in another One Piece character. We see little Kanjuro is not depicted as human, but instead he's a shapeless blob with no motivation, no dreams, not even a will to live. Orochi cleverly takes notice of this kid and shapes him like clay, giving him direction and a DF ability to make his job possible. Orochi went as far as to take revenge on the killers of Kanjuro's parents to try and gain his loyalty, but it seems like the kid is completely out it and doesn't care who killed who anymore. I assume that raised as an actor, Kanjuro mastered the ability to completely surmerge himself in his role. Normally actors have mental cues tied to real world attachments that allow them to pull themselves out of this state, but with his parents dead that bond was severed and Kanjuro ended up a sad blob. Orochi could easily see Kanjuro was clearly insane, but that made him the perfect actor for the role he was given. He didn't have any resements against Wano or his fellow Scabbards, he didn't really believe in Oden's dream, Kanjuro was just playing his role as Orochi's little spy.

I have to wonder what happens to Kanjuro after this. When you put Oden one foot in the grave, help Wano descend into 20 years of hell, is redemption even possible? What Pudding does for Big Mom is a child's play compared to a world-class talent like Kanjuro. Even if he becomes a double-agent at the last moment, it's still not good enough. Orochi or Kaido will kill him as a martyr and that serves as Kanjuro's atonement. The main problem is that we have a second traitor by the name of Apoo, and while I expect him to fully come around and join the Worst Gen, I don't see the same character writing being recycled for traitor Kanjuro in the same arc. One thing that would be lovely to see is Kanjuro becoming Kin'emon's destined opponent, the two Scabbards we've known the longest both with DFs and around the same age, the leader taking care of the traitor in a life or death, a battle for Momo. Perhaps he dies a villain, perhaps he expresses some regret and helps Kinemon before the moment of death. Kanjuro has shot up to my favorite #2 Scabbard, though that label shouldn't apply anymore.

Lastly, we see Luffy, Law and Kid appear from underwater Marineford-style in their ships. Magnificent seeing the Sabaody trio and their ships. This is no doubt Denjiro's work. Orochi's plans got subserverted by his own inside man Denjiro, not in simple fashion of countering his moves but going further to make him believe he succeeded. Kaido, Orochi and Big Mom should all be drinking away and not expecting any visitors. I wonder how Kid got wrapped up in all this? He was going around rescuing his crew, did Denjiro show up and make him an offer? Pirates schooling Samurai on how things are done in the seas. Boy, I am pumped to see some naval battles. I want to see Kid and Law's full crews and their pirate ships show off too.

Well, Kaidou wants to create a big war, the greatest the world has ever known. The Kozuki clan who created the poneglyphs is a perfect spark for this war. Doffy wanted the Celestial Dragons down, too. So this is a method for a big revolution. We know the Wano war will lead to something that makes Marineford look cute, so what if Kaidou succeeds at creating that war? What if that will be the intro to the final arc? Highly likely at this point tbh.

 

[Finalbeta]

Apoo is way too strong for that

Funnily Apoo will surpass Kidd easily one day. His DF + advanced haki is a devastating combo.

I wonder if we are going to see the other novas by next chapters still.

 

[SmokedOut]

I posted this in the spoilers discussion. I think it fits pretty well!

Young Kanjuro was a stagehand!

Kuroko (Japanese: 黒子, lit. "black child") are stagehands in traditional Japanese theatre, who dress all in black.

In kabuki, the kuroko serve many of the same purposes as running crew. They move scenery and props on stage, aiding in scene changes and costume changes. They will also often play the role of animals, will-o-the-wisps, or other roles which are played not by an actor in full costume, but by holding a prop. Kuroko wear all black, head to toe, in order to imply that they are invisible and not part of the action onstage.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuroko

So Kanjuro went from being an invisible stagehand to a starring role. His costume started as a background character, but as an adult he has a full Kabuki star outfit and face paint.

Wow, well done! That makes perfect sense and it fits into his whole narrative.