Perfect, now we have the rest of the world versus Aknolagon; including translators who have nothing to do with One Piece yet translated the concept as plural since it isn't singular nor plural by itself.
He wasn't, from the moment Marco says his "hanagata" line it's all about Zoro and Sanji striking the All-Stars in a parallelistic. The context is about the two young stars taking on the current stars to "dethrone" them. For "hanagata" to make narrative sense it needs to oppose the two lead performers that are already established on the stage; and that's what happens when Zoro and Sanji, together, strike King and Queen.
What do you mean he wasnt when he was literally there on the battlefield and fighting?
Zoro is the star that took the stage because he was off the stage during mummification.
And I have no clue what hanagata is.
Well, he has a good track record of translations so why would I doubt it...
What does it say?
What do you mean he wasnt when he was literally there on the battlefield and fighting?
Zoro is the star that took the stage because he was off the stage during mummification.
And I have no clue what hanagata is.
Hanagata toujou da yoi - The star takes the stage
Followed by two small panels of Zoro and Sanji both screaming their attack names
Followed by two small panels of King and Queem reacting
Followed by the double spread of them attacking together
Anyone that follows manga this long knows that japanese is wonky with plurals - sometimes you can spot it easily since it uses -tachi as a suffix, but most of the time whether something is plural or not is based on context. And considering how that whole page flows, the context of plural is evident, fandoms aside. This is purely lingustically.
Because tons of other translators with good track records on it say the opposite; including academics on Japan who treated the concept as plural way before One Piece was a thing.
What do you mean he wasnt when he was literally there on the battlefield and fighting?
Zoro is the star that took the stage because he was off the stage during mummification.
And I have no clue what hanagata is.
If you have no clue what "hanagata" is then makes sense you're missing the whole point of the scene.
"Hanagata" is something like "star actor"; the "star" word here refers to a performer. The narrative happening from the moment Marco takes a step back is that the two newcoming actors are taking on the old ones, the Lead Performers or All Stars of Kaidou.
That whole scene isn't about Zoro; it's about King and Queen as together, as the established performers, as the actors defeating Marco, who are next striked by the young actors finally ready to start their final one-on-one to dethrone them. It's built on Marco giving up against the TWO perfomers as, from his "hanagata" line, the youngsters take the stage together to take their place.
Again, it makes no sense for Marco to mean Zoro alone. That's the simplistic interpretation of a scene that is about the two Lead Performers facing the two newcoming actors from the new era. Zoro isn't the protagonist of this narrative.
Well, he has a good track record of translations so why would I doubt it...
What does it say?
What do you mean he wasnt when he was literally there on the battlefield and fighting?
Zoro is the star that took the stage because he was off the stage during mummification.
And I have no clue what hanagata is.
Great episode, the auras were in check and didn't disrupt the fantastic animation, the voice acting as phenomenal (love hearing Zoro and Sanji go at it), and the Marco bits were well done.
Some weird changes, but, it's Toei. The Arms instead of Wings is the only thing really pissing me off here.
Nice way for the anime to start off the year. Glad we'll get a better look at Jack's Hybrid form next episode.
Hanagata toujou da yoi - The star takes the stage
Followed by two small panels of Zoro and Sanji both screaming their attack names
Followed by two small panels of King and Queem reacting
Followed by the double spread of them attacking together
Anyone that follows manga this long knows that japanese is wonky with plurals - sometimes you can spot it easily since it uses -tachi as a suffix, but most of the time whether something is plural or not is based on context. And considering how that whole page flows, the context of plural is evident, fandoms aside. This is purely lingustically.
Whether it is star or stars, not an issue for me, I got no horse in this race.
All I am saying is what I saw Aknolagon say - it was always singular.
Yes, the parallel of them attacking together is there, however, the only star that wasnt on that stage already is Zoro.
It was all others protecting him, including Sanji and Marco, until medicine worked and he returned to the stage.
Because tons of other translators with good track records on it say the opposite; including academics on Japan who treated the concept as plural way before One Piece was a thing.
Who is the star that returned to the stage? The one star that was protected by everyone including Marco and Sanji?
Only 1 star hasnt been on that stage due to injuries - the star that shone brightest on the rooftop.
Whether it is star or stars, not an issue for me, I got no horse in this race.
All I am saying is what I saw Aknolagon say - it was always singular.
Yes, the parallel of them attacking together is there, however, the only star that wasnt on that stage already is Zoro.
It was all others protecting him, including Sanji and Marco, until medicine worked and he returned to the stage.
I havent seen anyone picking on Akno's translations and say they are bad.
I wish it happened in the manga since that is the source material...
Who is the star that returned to the stage? The one star that was protected by everyone including Marco and Sanji?
Only 1 star hasnt been on that stage due to injuries - the star that shone brightest on the rooftop.
The thing is, the phraseis singular, but the nature of the language makes the meaning (i.e. the use of it within the context) of it plural, if that makes sense.
It's a fact it can be plural, and Aknolagon can say whatever because you have tons of other translators using plural too and understanding it referred to Zoro and Sanji as a pair.
It's not about literally, physically being on the stage. It's about striking to dethrone another two actors. It's a clash of two generations of performers.
I'm not saying they are bad, I'm saying they aren't perfect, and when you have, again, tons of translators both of One Piece and other Japanese works using "hanagata" in plural, then maybe, just maybe, there's some room for doubt.
Who is the star that returned to the stage? The one star that was protected by everyone including Marco and Sanji?
Only 1 star hasnt been on that stage due to injuries - the star that shone brightest on the rooftop.
Again, it's not about returning but starting the final fight instead of teamworks, skirmishes and such. It's from the moment that Marco, whose whole narrative is about letting the New Era shine, speaks of the young actors taking the stage that everything focuses entirely on Zoro and Sanji, as a duo, striking the well-established Lead Performers who made Marco take a step aside and pronounce the "hanagata" line; marking this the beginning or their individual, final fights.
Zoro alone has no place here, it's not about coming physically to the stage; it's about the new actors (Zoro and Sanji) taking over the old era (Marco) in order to dethrone the old actors (King and Queen). Hence why Oda's whole paneling was plural.
And works way better in the context of the young actors taking over the new era to dethrone the old actors. Hence why the whole visual storytelling is about King and Queen and then Zoro and Sanji, not Zoro alone.
Seriously, the focus isn't Zoro but Zoro and Sanji versus King and Queen (important detail) from the moment Marco gives up against the old performers and the Straw Hats take his place. Oda can't be more obvious here.
It's a fact it can be plural, and Aknolagon can say whatever because you have tons of other translators using plural too and understanding it referred to Zoro and Sanji as a pair.
It's not about literally, physically being on the stage. It's about striking to dethrone another two actors. It's a clash of two generations of performers.
I'm not saying they are bad, I'm saying they aren't perfect, and when you have, again, tons of translators both of One Piece and other Japanese works using "hanagata" in plural, then maybe, just maybe, there's some room for doubt.
So is SBS wrote by Oda, who used the exact same wording for Robin's speech.
Again, it's not about returning but starting the final fight instead of teamworks, skirmishes and such. It's from the moment that Marco, whose whole narrative is about letting the New Era shine, speaks of the young actors taking the stage that everything focuses entirely on Zoro and Sanji, as a duo, striking the well-established Lead Performers who made Marco take a step aside and pronounce the "hanagata" line; marking this the beginning or their individual, final fights.
Zoro alone has no place here, it's not about coming physically to the stage; it's about the new actors (Zoro and Sanji) taking over the old era (Marco) in order to dethrone the old actors (King and Queen). Hence why Oda's whole paneling was plural.
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And works way better in the context of the young actors taking over the new era to dethrone the old actors. Hence why the whole visual storytelling is about King and Queen and then Zoro and Sanji, not Zoro alone.
Seriously, the focus isn't Zoro but Zoro and Sanji versus King and Queen (important detail) from the moment Marco gives up against the old performers and the Straw Hats take his place. Oda can't be more obvious here.
Nah that only works for sanjistans. In this context the only person not on the stage was Zoro. The only Star that joined the stage after Marco's statement was Zoro. So it works better and only for Zoro.
The focus is on Zoro when the statement was made 👌🏾. That's all that matters to everyone not salty ngl
Nah that only works for sanjistans. In this context the only person not on the stage was Zoro. The only Star that joined the stage after Marco's statement was Zoro. So it works better and only for Zoro.
The focus is on Zoro when the statement was made 👌🏾. That's all that matters to everyone not salty ngl
Thinking that the scene was about being physically on stage is simplistic and quite a basic take on it; it's about the new stars taking over the old era to dethrone the old performers. What defines the scene isn't Zoro being on stage but Marco giving up and Zoro and Sanji starting their final, individual fights that will help Luffy bring the new era.
It not only works better with Zoro and Sanji but it's the only way it truly works, starting by the fact Marco uses a kabuki term solely because he's facing two "kabuki actors". This plus how the whole scene is told in a parallelistic way (even the paneling) should be obvious enough, but apparently it isn't.
Again, Zoro isn't the protagonist here. The context requires two newcomers.
It's a fact it can be plural, and Aknolagon can say whatever because you have tons of other translators using plural too and understanding it referred to Zoro and Sanji as a pair.
It's not about literally, physically being on the stage. It's about striking to dethrone another two actors. It's a clash of two generations of performers.
I'm not saying they are bad, I'm saying they aren't perfect, and when you have, again, tons of translators both of One Piece and other Japanese works using "hanagata" in plural, then maybe, just maybe, there's some room for doubt.
So is SBS wrote by Oda, who used the exact same wording for Robin's speech.
Again, it's not about returning but starting the final fight instead of teamworks, skirmishes and such. It's from the moment that Marco, whose whole narrative is about letting the New Era shine, speaks of the young actors taking the stage that everything focuses entirely on Zoro and Sanji, as a duo, striking the well-established Lead Performers who made Marco take a step aside and pronounce the "hanagata" line; marking this the beginning or their individual, final fights.
Zoro alone has no place here, it's not about coming physically to the stage; it's about the new actors (Zoro and Sanji) taking over the old era (Marco) in order to dethrone the old actors (King and Queen). Hence why Oda's whole paneling was plural.
Post automatically merged:
And works way better in the context of the young actors taking over the new era to dethrone the old actors. Hence why the whole visual storytelling is about King and Queen and then Zoro and Sanji, not Zoro alone.
Seriously, the focus isn't Zoro but Zoro and Sanji versus King and Queen (important detail) from the moment Marco gives up against the old performers and the Straw Hats take his place. Oda can't be more obvious here.
Seems like only Sanji fans want it to be plural... Either way, I dont care. Sanji and Zoro havent shared anything in that fight other than couple of panels and then each went to a separate location. However, it can absolutely be about Zoro alone because he is the only star who wasnt on that stage already while Sanji and Queen have already been fighting each other...
If Sanji is the star, he was already on the stage. Zoro is the only one who makes sense because he didnt take that stage due to injuries.
Thinking that the scene was about being physically on stage is simplistic and quite a basic take on it; it's about the new stars taking over the old era to dethrone the old performers. What defines the scene isn't Zoro being on stage but Marco giving up and Zoro and Sanji starting their final, individual fights that will help Luffy bring the new era.
It not only works better with Zoro and Sanji but it's the only way it truly works, starting by the fact Marco uses a kabuki term solely because he's facing two "kabuki actors". This plus how the whole scene is told in a parallelistic way (even the paneling) should be obvious enough, but apparently it isn't.
Again, Zoro isn't the protagonist here. The context requires two newcomers.
Gonna say it 1 last time, not bothered about entertaining some sanjistan that cant hack his boy not being as relevant as Zoro in the grand scheme of things.
Marco says 1 star actor/player is gonna take the stage. The stage already has 4 people on it. They are King, Marco, Queen and sanji. This statement is directly followed by Zoro joining them on the stage.
The nursery level logic that every human should have by default, should tell you that Marco, was talking about Zoro. Even without having to look at japanese to english translations.
Zoro is 1 of 3 protagonists and in this case is the main protagonist Marco is talking about. The context requires 1 singular player/actor and that's Zoro.
Now cope someplace else cause this is just so funny it's sad now 😭
Drew two characters in a panel side by side CENTERED for emphasis in SYMBOLISM. The STORYBOARDER, an inferior biased not-creator decides to break that symbolism for their own damn opinions.
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